Casted on Youtube for the June 2v2 tournament.

Semifinals(W) (Group C), Game 2

I think Team 1 could have had that if Skasi had reacted to the growing reaper wall with some kind of counter pick instead of just MOAR RAVAGER!

Even GBCs know that big tank > small tank

- Hey Niko, it's Skasi! Let's go spam Darts.

Ironically, domis counter reapers for cost so hard it's not even funny.

You get 2 domis for 1 reaper, and then you get 2 domis AND the reaper; and as you increases numbers (4 domis for 2 reapers) it becomes worse and worse for the reapers.

quote: Ironically, domis counter reapers for cost so hard it's not even funny.

This has not been my experience. Since Reaper is actually faster than Domi in most situations they can either escape or just run the Domis down. Reapers also often have some kind of escort.

I mean, if the Reaper player makes a tactical or strategic error they can lose pretty bad.

As the numbers scale up... if you see your opponent massing Domi against your mass Reaper and you don't build one of the many, many things that counter Domi, see "strategic error" above. This is what it comes down to really; even if Domi beats Reaper, the margin of error you have with controlling the Domis is so low that anything else in the equation can wreck Domi, whereas Reaper doesn't really care.

As for countering Reaper:
- Mass Wolverine (you need a LOT of wolverines and some space to work with, but this has the advantage that a critical mass of Wolverines is a win condition in itself)
- Thunderbirds can help
- Scalpel-Penetrator
- Racketeer can make reapers sad at least
I don't know how well Goliath works for cost.
Ravager is hit-and-miss but can definitely work in the right situation. You need to engage in such a way that the Reapers can't just kill a few Ravagers then retreat to repair.
Low numbers of Reaper can be beaten by Scorcher but this is dicey when the reaperball gets bigger and/or it has escorts.
DDM will at least buy you some time generally.

quote: That said I'd be happy if anybody could mention a good counter to Reapers that is not Ulti.

That's like saying "give me a good cloakbot counter to Felon that is not Sharpshooter". There is no good counter. But Ulti is a great one and straight up makes you win games against high elo reaperspammers. Make Ulti, win games. Don't make Ulti, keep whining about Reaper.

Terraform is another counter. Especially if you can bury them in your territory.

Goliath is a very soft counter in that it will outscale the Reaper. Heavy porc + Goliaths is bound to win against heavy porc + Reapers, but it'll take time. Bonus points for Goliath being superior against possible lategame stuff from the enemy as well (Striders that aren't Ulti, tanking a Nuke to the face, etc).

In lower density there's many other counters as well, like fast Raiders, Spy, Placeholder, Racketeer, etc. I usually don't bother with those since Ulti is so good.

quote: [ISP]Lauri, no it's not like saying "give me a good cloakbot counter to Felon". I gave no factory restrictions.

That's completely missing the point. My point is that the counter is there but you for some reason decide to avoid it.

Really though, any kind of Reaperball is in the Strider weight class. At that point facswitching is dirt cheap so factory restrictions are of little importance.

quote: Chances are it does not make cost in a high elo game.

Highly disagree. I've had quite a lot of success applying it in 1v1, sometimes against some of the best players in ZK.

Implying 2v2 is that different from 1v1.

quote: They also deform terrain in a way which makes Reaper sad, on maps which aren't super hard at least.

That could be really nice if my teasm wasn't spamming units that rely on flat ground. Could make Scalpel+kbot spam on (large) flat maps a good strategy and probably comes with a big surprise factor too.

Placeholder might work as well, yup. Do you have any experience using it against more than a single Reaper though?


It seems most suggestions are too situational and not really an option on this map in games other than 1v1 or whatever. I suppose that's why I see mirror matchups very often.