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Title: AI wars
Host: CZrankSpringiee270
Game version: Zero-K v1.3.11.3
Engine version: 100.0
Started: 8 years ago
Duration: 29 minutes
Players: 0
Bots: True
Mission: False
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Circuit acted like it was smart enough to identify new routes and abuse them

who was the other ai

why did circuit take so long to make striders, or does it qualify crabe as a strider?
+0 / -0


8 years ago
Circuit 0.7.6 with the hermit lover profile was south, ZKGBAI 0.3 was north.

Circuits pathfinder does make rather excellent use of Spider all-terrain :)

20 minutes is about right for strider transition, how early are you expecting them to appear?
+0 / -0
After Circuit 0.7.4 transition to striders takes place after 2nd factory (hardcoded). I want to add more fun with regular units, not mono-spam efficient striders (don't know if i achieved more fun but that was the goal).

I will deffinitly put 1v0ry_k1ng's config as default (normal.json) and save mine as easy.json (because of unit variance though not efficient). So one could change difficulty level in AIOptions and play against different config.

(actually i can add new option "Config=<name>" to select arbitrary configs, unfortunatly AIOptions.lua have to be edited manually)
+0 / -0
quote:
I want to add more fun with regular units, not mono-spam efficient striders (don't know if i achieved more fun but that was the goal).

My 2c

In my experience, fun vs an AI is the product of it doing the unexpected and suprising the player, going all-in and launching massive attacks and in being distributed over the map/hard to kill.

Players need to feel a real danger of losing if they screw up, or the fun quickly fades. Human players need significant battles to explicity start, happen and end, with a lull before the next one - constant battle, harass and attrition is harder to quantify and does not give as much satisfaction to the player. Players also like to know that doing damage hurts the AI and explicitly impairs its function - they dont like to feel that the AI is an inexorable swarm that cares nothing for its components and quickly regenerates any damage received (even though this is closer to the truth).

Making the build order less predictable would probably make for more suprises - having it vary between 1 to 3 factories before striders perhaps.

Massive attacks sort happen, although it is a slow, measured advance under the current handling rather than a plunging strike.

Circuit already does a pretty good job of distributing itself by having two facs with build power in different parts of the map. Having more facs/foward repair points in the mid/late game that units are sent to instead of all the way across the map to its base would help further (essentially these are 'mini bases' that the player will enjoy over-running).
+0 / -0


8 years ago
In my opinion:

A fun AI (for normal non-masochist users) should not:
1.) overly-frustrate the user. This leads to lack of fun = rage quit, never to return.
2.) cause overly laggy games. This leads to point 1.
3.) Feel cheaty/godlike.
4.) Have a lack of perceived progression against. EG: should not optimize for a stalemate situation (cuz those are boring)
5.) Feel repetitive. This leads to boredom.
6.) Take forever to kill. There should be some point where it allows the user to accept victory and move on. (Look at AoE III's AI. They allow you to accept surrender = faster victory) This option allows those who just want it to end to end it fast and those who want to continue on and kill every last unit to do so.

Fun AI should feel:
1.) Rewarding to play with/against.
2.) Interesting to play with.
3.) unpredictable.
+1 / -0
I would like to add that it should encourage good play: aggressive and good eco instead of porcing. This could be done by making the AI expand naked sometimes (reward raiding) and dealing effectively with porc by not suiciding, making arty and/or assaults.
+0 / -0