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Title: MM 2187: 1v1, Rank Supergiant
Host: Nobody
Game version: Zero-K v1.9.1.1
Engine version: 104.0.1-1544-ge1f249f
Started: 57 days ago
Duration: 9 minutes
Players: 2
Bots: False
Mission: False
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Team 1
Chance of victory: 82.1%

RUrankApofenas
Team 2
Chance of victory: 17.9%

NZrankDouble_Helix_DNA
Spectators
IDrankrifqifajarzain

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I actually have to ask, what does Glaive do well?
It has poor range, is not fast enough, and cannot handle even 1 or 2 Lotus.
If you face an opponent who raids with higher-weight units, i.e Apofenas, then the only thing you can do is to build Reaver and expand with that, unless you want to lose massive amounts of Glaive while trying to raid. Oh yeah; the enemy can reclaim dead Glaives, which will inevitably occur. So not only have you lost 65-130 metal, you've donated 20 or 80 metal to your opponent.

Which essentially means you lose map control if you try and raid with Glaive, or try and expand with Reaver.
+0 / -0


57 days ago
My advice for this game is to make a bit Lotus earlier. A Glaive or two supporting a Lotus is much more effective than Glaive or a Lotus by itself, since Lotus is killed by diving and Glaives are killed by poking. You built seven Solars before your base Lotus, and lost three mexes to Kodachi because of it.

I agree that Glaive is perhaps looking a bit weak. I think it is good at being efficient but is deceptively cheap. For example, by 5:00:
  • 1430 metal in Glaive had been built.
  • 1800 metal in Kodachi had been built.
  • 780 metal in Glaive had died.
  • 900 metal in Kodachi had died.
A higher proportion of Glaives died, but achieving such a close proportion is impressive when taking into account Lanchester's square law. I would want to see what happens when cloaky invests as much into Glaive as other factories invest into heavier raiders. Of course, such an investment may be too easily hit by attrition and countered, which may be a reason people avoid it, or maybe their cost is being underestimated.

Maybe it would be worth making and moving Glaives in squads of three. A lone Glaive doesn't do very much, it is essentially an expensive Flea that can kill mexes a bit faster, but with three you can start fighting heavier raiders and killing Lotus.
+2 / -0

57 days ago
quote:
I actually have to ask, what does Glaive do well?


very good dps for cost, auto-regen. if you actually manage to get an opening, they are really impressive.

quote:
I would want to see what happens when cloaky invests as much into Glaive as other factories invest into heavier raiders.


the same as ravager vs minotaur. the problem is that higher-hp units can engage, generate attrition and pull back to repair. auto-regen should counter that but glaives are so fragile that it is really really hard to pull of and not get forced to commit to unfavourable encounters. 3 glaives isn`t enough i think. you could kill 1 lotus, 1 glaive survives and can start to kill the formerly protected mexes, but a single enemy-unit that arrives in the meantime will pretty likely turn that into straight feeding, with all the attrition-problem mentioned above.

Idk, i struggle to see glaives as BAD, but to me it FEELS like the game around them has changed so much that the unit that was so good before is simply not keeping up anymore.
+2 / -0
56 days ago
I'm curious if nerfing back the economy start would help Glaives in the early game, I suspect it's just a little too easy to pump out two heavy raiders right now with little economy damage in comparison to the granularity of Glaive.

Starting income of 6m/8e is massive compared to the olden days, starting metal and energy is good enough for a lot of production, and commanders can tank half a dozen Glaives at level 1 without too much worry (plus free radar) so defense isn't an immediate concern from the get go. I think it might be a little too easy to get into a stable start even with the more expensive factories right now.
+1 / -0
56 days ago
I must agree with USrankLegomenon

I don't think Glaives are bad, DErankkatastrophe named their strong points in his post.
But they got nerved hard by having their ability to raid early taken away due to other changes.

Just Com-Radar is kinda op for "Raider-lazy" players.
Because why even do raiders, get your anti raider and always be in position when a raider approaches.
+0 / -0


56 days ago
The starting economy is an interesting point. I don't want to go all the way back to the rocky starts of the past, but perhaps it could be reduced a little. I'll try reducing metal income by 1 and starting storage by 50.

I don't plan to remove the comm radar. I consider radar to be a near-mandatory part of a starting build so it may as well be integrated.
+2 / -0