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Commanders Wanted!

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DISCLAIMER: THIS IS MERELY A THOUGH EXPERIMENT. I DO NOT WISH TO START ANY WARS.


Note: everything enclosed in spoiler will break the immersion
shortened words used in spoilers:
[Spoiler]


COMMANDERS WANTED!




Good Day fellow commander. One of our expeditionary probes have stumbled upon a new sector of space, and it's scanner have shown untold deposits of metal are just lying around on the surface of these planets. Of course, we imminently seized the opportunity and used our supply of warp cores to send across an entire string connector. Allowing unrestricted access into this new space.

Further scans using more powerful devices have shown that the surface deposits are not as pure as previously though, though metal can still be extracted with difficulty. More importantly, the scan showed that several other species are already inhabiting the sector (which is know to them as the Koprulu Sector). Although they outnumber as perhaps 100:1 we can still use our tactical minds to overcome them one-by-one.

So fellow commanders. I would like us to create a stratagem to crush our foes and claim this industrial hub for the greater good!

I would advise you to avoid relying on our superweapons (trinity, striders, bertha, DRP, Zenith, Starlight ect). The should only be used as a last-resort as the more frequent they are used, the more likely or foes would be able to come up with a counter.

TL;DR: SC vs ZK in a fight 2 the death



Balancing:
[Spoiler]


I will continue updating this post as new ideas are submitted.
Changelog:
[Spoiler]
Sign Up List (does nothing):
[Spoiler]
+1 / -0
3 years ago
i dont understand at all.. is this starcraft? did you want more resource types? like geo making a gas? and reclaimable crystals on map.. and you use those to make supers or special techs?
+0 / -0
3 years ago
basicly who would win: the ZK autonoma or the 3 SC races in a FIGHT TO DA 0 HP
+0 / -0
3 years ago
if zk can reclaim the dead it would win.. and if you balanced it.. perfectly.. then it will all come down to whoever had more coffee
+0 / -0
3 years ago
not really, since eventaully the minerals will mine out and the mexes will keep going. so it's in the SC player's intrest to end it quick.
+1 / -0


3 years ago
ZK has no Detector units.
+0 / -0
3 years ago
We'll have to use the good old "get close to reveal"
also needs to add that
+0 / -0

3 years ago
Marines with auto skirmish, lol
+0 / -0

3 years ago
quote:
ZK has no Detector units.


Every ZK unit is Detector. Every unit in ZK can allow see enemy invisible unit.
+1 / -0
No Starcraft units are capable of modifying terrain. Only a limited subset can ignore it, and most of those would be targeted by AA.

Oh wait. Colossus is also targeted by AA. Have fun being face fisted by Artemis.
+3 / -0

3 years ago
quote:
Have fun being face fisted by Artemis.


Can't aa attack drone when its building so it manufacturer got splash dmg? I think once i saw that artemis killed reef and com shooting at it when drone was building. Just with aoe. Of course its very rare situation. :D
+0 / -0


3 years ago
Artemis deals splash damage to non-air units, but only at 5% rate or so.
+0 / -0
3 years ago
Were do I sign up?
+0 / -0
3 years ago
USrankSynthwave good question, will fix though

EErankAdminAnarchid you need to factor in the cost of artemis as well, you can get a fleet of carriers for how much it costs.=. i've though about banning AA due to how op it is but we need something to counter tactical jump.

LVrankSenaven artemis can probably kill all stargates since they unit they are building is "inside" them? RIP carrierballs though
+0 / -0
3 years ago
What would be the equivalent of antinuke for Starcraft?
+0 / -0
3 years ago
if they dont know about the nuke they wont have anything to counter it. but if we abuse it then they will figure out a counter. so we only use it against heavy SC porc and let no one survive...

they cant conter it...
+0 / -0
Swarm them with spiders. The minerals-based species depend on cliffs protect their fragile miners. A Flea can be in their base before they even have a Spawning Pool, Barracks, or Gateway.

Zergling (after conversion):

Flea:
  • Cost: 25
  • Health: 40
  • Speed: 144 elmos/second
  • Range: 150
  • DPS: 42
  • Can fire while moving.
  • Can detect cloaked units by decloaking itself.

Flea is faster than all ground units (except with creep or upgrade shenanigans), has some range, fires while moving, and abuses cliffs. What more do we need.

Zerg are out-zerged. A Sunken Colony 1-shots a Flea but the cost, tech, and build time seem far too high.

Protoss are absolutely screwed. Zealot has no hope. Dragoons and Cannons 1-shot Flea but with a poor refire rate. If they try anything aggressive with Cannons, well, Lotus outranges their 350 elmo range, and Commanders can easily tank their 54 DPS.

Terran may just hold against Flea with Marine, if we ignore the fact that they won't even have a Barracks by the time the first flea is in their base. Its ability to fire through allies might make for a viable wall.

Marine (after conversion):
  • Cost: 38.46
  • Health: 100
  • Speed: 93.3 elmos/second
  • Range: 200 elmos
  • DPS: 23.8
  • Cannot fire while moving.
  • Can fire through allied units and buildings.

Things get a bit more interesting if both sides start with some presence on the map. Our units tend to be ridiculously powerful but cost quite a lot. For example, Stinger 1-shots almost everything with the exception of heavies such as Battlecruiser, Carrier and Archon (funnily enough, Venom 1-shots Archon if EMP interacts). Stinger also happens to outrange everything, even a sieged Siege Tank. Redback has ridiculous health and DPS, and decent range. The range and DPS of our AA deletes air units. Crab is most likely a win condition.

The biggest threat is probably Ghosts, with their difficulty to detect and https://liquipedia.net/starcraft/Ghost#Lockdown

We might start to have trouble if limited to units that cost more than 200. That said, Lockdown doesn't work on structures so we would probably be fine.
+3 / -0

3 years ago
that unit comparison makes sense lore-wise given that Zero-K takes place a lot further in the future than SC:BW. One "balance" change that would even the odds slightly would be if the first factory plop wasn't free/instant. Of course, a level 1 commander would make short work of just about everything anyways...
+0 / -0
3 years ago
@Googlefrog the Mk2 of the siege tank (aka SC2 siege tank) does outrange the stinger by 30 elmos.
also you need to take into account that they outnamber us vastly, so one commander will often have to fight 5 enemies, with flea rush being able to kill maybe one before mariens are sent to all the mineral lines.
but even with 1v5 it should still be balanced
A few advantages and disadvantageous we have over each race:
Terran:
disadvantages:
1. marines can shut down fleas
2. siege tanks barely outrange stingers
3. stim can be hard to counter
4. ghosts are a nightmare, and our antinukes may not be able to intercept their nuke
5. BCs can tacjump onto inportant structure
6. sensor towers
7. ground-based mech is a strong lategame
8. scans
advantages:
1. the staionary nature of siege tanks make them suseptable to our arty
2. MMM can't be pulled off as our AA is godly
3. BCs would die quickly
4. Large reliance on gas and MULEs means they cannot take heavy advantage of reclaim
5. Planetary fortress is kinda strong
Zerg:
disadvantages:
1. roachs have heavy armor and will be esp. strong against high-rof units
2. infestors allow zerg to have access to their allies' race's tech
3. the swarm host can outrange even some arty
4. creep slows out units down hard and gives vision. tumors are hard to dislodge
5. zerg late-game isn't that air heavy
6. nydus
advantages:
1. stardust shuts down lings hard
2. banes are sh*T against our heavies
3. lack of AA.
4. their supply flies
5. none of that classic zerg rush since comm
Protoss:
disadvantages:
1. observer is cloaked
2. DT is similar to scythe
3. warpgates can diliver crap to anywhere in the psi field
4. halluncinations
advantages:
1. DT cant attack army units
2. basiclly all protoss cheese isn't viable due to comm(cannon rush) and aa(proxy stargate)
3. protoss late-game is air-heavy(carrier, tempest, yo mammaship and colossi are all suseptable to artemis)
4. their shields are melted by status effects
+0 / -0
quote:
with flea rush being able to kill maybe one before mariens are sent to all the mineral lines.

I was running the math for a lotv marine, and it takes 4 seconds for the Marine to kill a Flea (10 dps vs 40 hp). It takes 2.6 seconds for the flea to kill a marine (42 dps vs 45*2.5 hp). Marines don't exactly counter Fleas here. Marine has a range advantage that perhaps lets it have 1 shot before ranges are matched, but thus only translates into extra kills once you have many.

This means the marine loses to the flea, while marines plural are equal in direct combat while much slower and blocked by cliffs. Stimpack changes the kill time from 4s to 3s, which is important but still barely adequate. Stimpack also hurts the Marine.

The defender could of course match the investment, but the Flea is considerably cheaper, and Flea speed comes into mind. If all your Marines are guarding your minerals, then none are guarding your barracks. And if not all of them are guarding the same place, fleas can abuse their speed and mobility to beat them piecemeal.

If you are fighting multiple adversaries, just send a flea to each, kill their first Marine (if there even is one by this time), then kill workers. Use UnitAI to fight the simultaneous engagements.

BW marine is weaker for all intents and purposes, and has practically no range lead over Flea.
+0 / -0
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