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Current MMR system

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Date Editor Before After
5/23/2018 11:27:55 AMPLrankZenfur before revert after revert
5/23/2018 11:25:17 AMPLrankZenfur before revert after revert
5/23/2018 11:23:56 AMPLrankZenfur before revert after revert
5/23/2018 11:19:09 AMPLrankZenfur before revert after revert
Before After
1 @GoogleFrog 1 @GoogleFrog
2 [quote] 2 [quote]
3 The critiques of myself and others generally boil down to the MMR system being written for mathematical accuracy instead of in a way that makes sense for general humans. We can apply this generalization here. 3 The critiques of myself and others generally boil down to the MMR system being written for mathematical accuracy instead of in a way that makes sense for general humans. We can apply this generalization here.
4 \n 4 \n
5 You don't see meaningful changes after individual games because changes on a short timescale tend to be meaningless. The MMR system doesn't care that humans can derive some enjoyment or meaning by, essentially, indulging in the gamblers fallacy or Pavlovian conditioning. I consider attempts to add such feedback to have failed because the underlying system does not contain any human0-meaningful concept of post-game MMR adjustment. 5 You don't see meaningful changes after individual games because changes on a short timescale tend to be meaningless. The MMR system doesn't care that humans can derive some enjoyment or meaning by, essentially, indulging in the gamblers fallacy or Pavlovian conditioning. I consider attempts to add such feedback to have failed because the underlying system does not contain any human0-meaningful concept of post-game MMR adjustment.
6 [/quote] 6 [/quote]
7 \n 7 \n
8 Seems fixable. Possible solution: 8 Seems fixable. Possible solution:
9 * keep current system as a hidden elo, or true elo 9 * keep current system as a hidden elo, or true elo
10 * make up fake elo which is visible instead hidden elo which has few simple rules: 10 * make up fake elo which is visible instead hidden elo which has few simple rules:
11 - never loose virtual skill number on victory 11 - never loose virtual skill number on victory
12 - never gain virtual skill number on loss 12 - never gain virtual skill number on loss
13 - adjust virtual skill number change according to it's relative position with true elo to make them converge over time, like smallest possible change: +/-5, greatest possible change, +/-50 13 - adjust virtual skill number change according to it's relative position with true elo to make them converge over time, like smallest possible change: +/-5, greatest possible change, +/-50
14 \n 14 \n
15 This way we lie to ourselves with new system so we keep our sanity and everyone sees intuitive number. 15 This way we lie to ourselves with new system so we keep our sanity and everyone sees intuitive number.
16 \n 16 \n
17 Examples: 17 Examples:
18 * your true elo: 1800, your virutal skill number: 1600, you win: you gain around 40-50 virtual skill number 18 * your true elo: 1800, your virutal skill number: 1600, you win: you gain around 40-50 virtual skill number
19 * your true elo: 1600, your virutal skill number: 1800, you win: you gain 5 virtual skill number 19 * your true elo: 1600, your virutal skill number: 1800, you win: you gain 5 virtual skill number
20 * your true elo: 1700, your virutal skill number: 1700, you win: you gain your true elo difference, with minimum of 5. 20 * your true elo: 1700, your virutal skill number: 1700, you win: you gain your true elo difference, with minimum of 5.
21 * your true elo: 1600, your virutal skill number: 1800, you loose: you loose 40-50 virtual skill number 21 * your true elo: 1600, your virutal skill number: 1800, you loose: you loose 40-50 virtual skill number
22 * your true elo: 1800, your virutal skill number: 1600, you loose: you loose 5 virtual skill number 22 * your true elo: 1800, your virutal skill number: 1600, you loose: you loose 5 virtual skill number
23 \n 23 \n
24 You could adjust limits and quantities to make them converge slower. There's a math formula which describes the relative change left to make up depending on how would you like it to converge. Limit of base(25?)+sqrt(difference) seems like one way to go. 24 You could adjust limits and quantities to make them converge slower. There's a math formula which describes the relative change left to make up depending on how would you like it to converge. Limit of base(25?)+sqrt(difference) seems like one way to go.
25 \n 25 \n
26 I'm not sure how dense WHR system is. Possibly changes should be around +/- 1/10 not 5/50 and scaled up with size of teams in game. 26 I'm not sure how dense WHR system is. Possibly changes should be around +/- 1/10 not 5/50 and scaled up with size of teams in game.
27 \n
28 btw, @[GBC]1v0ry_k1ng it's cool you are still with zk after so many years and little time to play :)