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Give Djinn a Cloak

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6 months ago
Djinn feels underused and kinda unfun since you need to lug around an engineer or cloak. It's just an all around pain and a total newb trap since they always get caught.

In the spirit of making an unfun unit into a fun unit, I propose: give Djinn a cloak.
+2 / -0


6 months ago
I'm not so sure about that. I like units with single uses. Also cloak breaks underwater anyway.

See this post (after the quotes): https://zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/35938?postID=255624#255624
quote:
Let me belabour this point as it is an important one. When someone says...
+3 / -0

6 months ago
quote:
since they always get caught.


??? I think rooks disagrees with that.
+2 / -0
I think this is an issue of not being inventive with djinn and always using it for deep infiltration of enemy lines.

Context:
Djinn allows you to move units across extremely long distances.

So why do we not see:

Rapid transport to the front in the form of a Djinn? It can bring heavy units to the front much quicker. Gives much-needed reinforcement in heavy battles.
Evacuating VIU away from the front line? You plop Djinn near cons, open up a portal and bring back that 1000HP grizzly for immediate repair.
Redeployment around the front line? Need to move from one spot to force a breakthrough? Have Djinn teleport the bulk of an army to other part of the front.

I picked these three specifically because adding cloak does not help much - Djinn should never be in the firing lines anyway.
Cloak would make Djinn do one job - infiltration, when we have not used it in innovative ways first.

I say let's try to find a use for Djinn, and only if we find nothing but infiltration then give djinn the cloak.

As an aside, infiltration of enemy lines probably should remain risky and costly. Djinn is one of the few units able to teleport anything from a glaive to an 8K metal army into the opponent's heartland and do so completely undetected.
+2 / -1
Tbh if you use djinn to get your units to the frontline faster, you don't need a cloak, and if you try to use it to make some sneak attack in an enemy backline, you build it with an athena, that has a radar jammer on its own and can build a conjurer for 80 metal to cloak the djinn.
+2 / -0
6 months ago
So then, um, WTF are the Charon and Hercules for? The last time they seem to have been updated seems, as in, 'I don't know when, haven't checked, and am going off context clues,' to have been before hotkeys was a thing, as the button to do the action of transporting units literally has (Shift) as part of its description. Oh, yah, and nobody uses them. If we could have like, a really slow multi unit cloaked unit carrier, that would be nice. And, no, this is not meant to be rude, I'm just Very curious.
+0 / -0
Charon's current role is as bootleg likho (by dropping snitches on the enemy) or as bootleg blimpy (by dropping riots on the enemy backlines). It's tiny HP pool does make it die if there's any aa presecence but it's quite powerful if you have the apm and the enemy doesn't have AA
Herc's current role is again for hotdrops on the front lines, as well as commnapping. Herc drops with dante and shogun both work quite well, and it also allows detriment to get to the frontlines quicker

TL:DR - The transports are more for moving units quickly into the heat of battle, while Djinn is more for moving large amounts of units while not in combat, and sometimes through enemy lines.

On the original post. Djinn is fine. as NZrankDouble_Helix_DNA Said, Most uses for Djinn either dont require cloak or are done with Athena, which has innate jamming and area cloak with conji
+1 / -0
Djinn is quite strong as is IMO. The fact it is not used much has little to do with Djinn and more with nature of players - they lack initiative to innovate. Having hercules bring in a couple of Djinns behind enemy lines could be very fun in a team game, and the key reason this is not done is lack of foresight. Also one can conceivably build Djinn with Athena if cloak is desired and a suitable location is available. Arguably, most ZK maps lack appropriate places to hide such an operation reliably due to how radar works, which may be the actual reason Djinn sees little use.

If I play a lobpot I'll try using it more though - it is fun and deserves love.
+2 / -0
6 months ago
https://zero-k.info/replays/20231012_232821_Tangerine_105.1.1-1821-gaca6f20%20BAR105.sdfz

Only time I found a good use for one.
+0 / -0
6 months ago
DErankkatastrophe yea. its kinda cool as is, you can often walk it from water undetected for enough to tele dante on a beach or something silly as that

giving djin a cloak could be nice, tho its not that much of pain in covert ops, ploping constructor with its cloak usuall sorts out that problem of long term hidden djin, jumping otoh could be nicer (or adding lobster dgun to athena with 3x lobster reload, or at least one riot unit to its unit pool)
+0 / -0