| 1 |
Hi,
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1 |
Hi,
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| 2 |
\n
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2 |
\n
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| 3 |
I've been playing SC2 a bit for the last week, and I found the experience infuriating. ZK was my first RTS (other than OTA which I played for a year when I was ~10), so maybe my expectations were a bit skewed. However, I was astounded that a game with this type of design could become so popular.
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3 |
I've been playing SC2 a bit for the last week, and I found the experience infuriating. ZK was my first RTS (other than OTA which I played for a year when I was ~10), so maybe my expectations were a bit skewed. However, I was astounded that a game with this type of design could become so popular.
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| 4 |
\n
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4 |
\n
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| 5 |
For anyone who hasn't tried SC2 or similar games, I'll outline the experience:
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5 |
For anyone who hasn't tried SC2 or similar games, I'll outline the experience:
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| 6 |
\n
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6 |
\n
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| 7 |
[spoiler]
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7 |
[spoiler]
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- Spawn
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8 |
- Spawn
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- Immediately mash the button to build a worker
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9 |
- Immediately mash the button to build a worker
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- Check back every 17 seconds and MAKE SURE YOU ARE ALWAYS BUILDING WORKERS OR YOU LOSE GG
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10 |
- Check back every 17 seconds and MAKE SURE YOU ARE ALWAYS BUILDING WORKERS OR YOU LOSE GG
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- Try to remember which branch of your tech tree isn't hard-countered by the enemy player's race (you pick your race ahead of time, and there are only three)
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11 |
- Try to remember which branch of your tech tree isn't hard-countered by the enemy player's race (you pick your race ahead of time, and there are only three)
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- Build a supply unit or you "run out of food" and can't build units even with enough resources.
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12 |
- Build a supply unit or you "run out of food" and can't build units even with enough resources.
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- Build your shitty first building
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- Build your shitty first building
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- OH SHIT YOU WERE LATE MAKING A WORKER GG
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- OH SHIT YOU WERE LATE MAKING A WORKER GG
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- Build additional fucking pylons, scrub
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- Build additional fucking pylons, scrub
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- Now maybe it's time for a unit or something
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16 |
- Now maybe it's time for a unit or something
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- Continue frantically jamming your hotkeys, making sure your (several) build queues are neither empty nor full (QUEUEING A UNIT IMMEDIATELY DEDUCTS THE RESOURCES!)
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- Continue frantically jamming your hotkeys, making sure your (several) build queues are neither empty nor full (QUEUEING A UNIT IMMEDIATELY DEDUCTS THE RESOURCES!)
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- Remember which shitty building you have to build to build the unit you need to build
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- Remember which shitty building you have to build to build the unit you need to build
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- Hopefully you scouted your enemy's base and have memorized the tech tree and the branch to counter his build
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- Hopefully you scouted your enemy's base and have memorized the tech tree and the branch to counter his build
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- And also scouted your own base for that proxy gate
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- And also scouted your own base for that proxy gate
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- And also know the ratio of gas:minerals for your build
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- And also know the ratio of gas:minerals for your build
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- And have studied the precise timings of the build order
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- And have studied the precise timings of the build order
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- Maybe someday you build a respectable army
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- Maybe someday you build a respectable army
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- And engage the enemy, whose army is probably four times larger because you missed that worker remember?
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- And engage the enemy, whose army is probably four times larger because you missed that worker remember?
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- Steamrolled gg
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- Steamrolled gg
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[/spoiler]
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[/spoiler]
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\n
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\n
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| 28 |
In short, ladder play in SC2 is an inflammatory experience. I'm 1-11 after ranking into the second lowest league. Compare with ZK, where I actually won the second game I ever played ( http://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/265827 ). The barrier to entry in SC2 is ridiculous and frustrating. Worse, the design goals of SC2 are terrible. It's unbelievable that a game whose primary virtues are button mashing, tedium, and rote memorization has become so popular (46,000 games running worldwide as I type this). I also realized that if ZK could become 0.1% as popular as SC2, it would be a wildly successful open source game. IMO, ZK is much more than 0.1% as good as SC2, I would actually say 1000% :)
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In short, ladder play in SC2 is an inflammatory experience. I'm 1-11 after ranking into the second lowest league. Compare with ZK, where I actually won the second game I ever played ( http://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/265827 ). The barrier to entry in SC2 is ridiculous and frustrating. Worse, the design goals of SC2 are terrible. It's unbelievable that a game whose primary virtues are button mashing, tedium, and rote memorization has become so popular (46,000 games running worldwide as I type this). I also realized that if ZK could become 0.1% as popular as SC2, it would be a wildly successful open source game. IMO, ZK is much more than 0.1% as good as SC2, I would actually say 1000% :)
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\n
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29 |
\n
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| 30 |
This
sort
of
got
me
to
thinking,
how
is
something
like
SC2
a
blockbuster
hit,
but
ZK
is
marginalized
blip
even
within
the
OSS
community?
I
reject
the
notion
that
it
has
anything
to
do
with
gameplay.
ZK
is
fun
and
accessible
even
to
people
who
have
never
played
RTS
games,
SC2
is
a
Kafkaesque
exercise
in
minutia
and
complexity.
I
think
it
has
to
do
with
more
superficial
things:
|
30 |
This
sort
of
got
me
to
thinking,
how
is
something
like
SC2
a
blockbuster
hit,
but
ZK
is
a
marginalized
blip
even
within
the
OSS
community?
I
reject
the
notion
that
it
has
anything
to
do
with
gameplay.
ZK
is
fun
and
accessible
even
to
people
who
have
never
played
RTS
games,
SC2
is
a
Kafkaesque
exercise
in
minutia
and
complexity.
I
think
it
has
to
do
with
more
superficial
things:
|
| 31 |
\n
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31 |
\n
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| 32 |
- Visibility: ZK is kind of hard to find. I've been using OSS for almost nine years and I've just found it last May or so. Since it's not packaged, the millions of people using linux (i.e. the users with the best disposition to try ZK) have to look outside the typical source for almost all software, the package manager. Instead of stumbling accross it, they will only find it via an active google search for a free RTS. Maybe license stuff makes ZK ineligible for Debian etc, but I stand by this observation.
|
32 |
- Visibility: ZK is kind of hard to find. I've been using OSS for almost nine years and I've just found it last May or so. Since it's not packaged, the millions of people using linux (i.e. the users with the best disposition to try ZK) have to look outside the typical source for almost all software, the package manager. Instead of stumbling accross it, they will only find it via an active google search for a free RTS. Maybe license stuff makes ZK ineligible for Debian etc, but I stand by this observation.
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\n
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\n
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- Production Value: Obviously, something with a budget like SC2 is going to be leagues ahead of ZK. That being said, I think ZK looks pretty damn good on high settings. I think there's still some low hanging fruit though. Clunky animations, goofy sounds, that sort of thing.
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34 |
- Production Value: Obviously, something with a budget like SC2 is going to be leagues ahead of ZK. That being said, I think ZK looks pretty damn good on high settings. I think there's still some low hanging fruit though. Clunky animations, goofy sounds, that sort of thing.
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| 35 |
\n
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35 |
\n
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| 36 |
- UX: I hate to bring this up, because I know the term gets thrown around a lot. But I'm willing to bet we lose a lot of newbies to UX stuff. I'll put the website aside, and specifically address ZKL. This is the entrypoint to a person's experience with ZK, and whether it's fair or not the interface heavily influences someone's impression of the game. Further, UX/interface bugs can cause an otherwise happy player to walk away in frustration (e.g. if the game crashes during launch, maps fail to download, lobby hangs, bugs out, becomes unresponsive). Not only that, it's pretty hard to look at. It was pretty clearly designed by a programmer :) Has any ever thought of contracting some static mocks? You could get a lot of high quality designs to choose from for a couple hundred bucks on 99designs. I guess implementation is another question, but it might be a good start.
|
36 |
- UX: I hate to bring this up, because I know the term gets thrown around a lot. But I'm willing to bet we lose a lot of newbies to UX stuff. I'll put the website aside, and specifically address ZKL. This is the entrypoint to a person's experience with ZK, and whether it's fair or not the interface heavily influences someone's impression of the game. Further, UX/interface bugs can cause an otherwise happy player to walk away in frustration (e.g. if the game crashes during launch, maps fail to download, lobby hangs, bugs out, becomes unresponsive). Not only that, it's pretty hard to look at. It was pretty clearly designed by a programmer :) Has any ever thought of contracting some static mocks? You could get a lot of high quality designs to choose from for a couple hundred bucks on 99designs. I guess implementation is another question, but it might be a good start.
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| 37 |
\n
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37 |
\n
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| 38 |
I don't really have a point, just that SC2 sucks and ZK should be more popular :<
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38 |
I don't really have a point, just that SC2 sucks and ZK should be more popular :<
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Starcraft II Sucks!