| 1 |
Well
there
does
not
seem
to
be
any
consensus
here.
.
.
however
just
to
clarify
what
you
are
suggesting
for
more
noobish
players
like
myself:
Volverine
nullification
with
hovers
requires:
|
1 |
Well
there
does
not
seem
to
be
any
consensus
here.
.
.
however
just
to
clarify
what
@GoogleFrog
is
suggesting
for
more
noobish
players
like
myself:
Volverine
nullification
with
hovers
requires:
|
| 2 |
* 2 halberds micro'd such that they are on hold fire, switched back normal when attacked.
|
2 |
* 2 halberds micro'd such that they are on hold fire, switched back normal when attacked.
|
| 3 |
* 1 hover con to repair, + active micro to bring back the damaged halberd for repairs
|
3 |
* 1 hover con to repair, + active micro to bring back the damaged halberd for repairs
|
| 4 |
* does not protect anything except the area (e.g if there is a few defenders they will still get hit)
|
4 |
* does not protect anything except the area (e.g if there is a few defenders they will still get hit)
|
| 5 |
* do you REALLY see that happening at <2200 ELO???
|
5 |
* do you REALLY see that happening at <2200 ELO???
|
| 6 |
\n
|
6 |
\n
|
| 7 |
Same thing with thugs/convicts:
|
7 |
Same thing with thugs/convicts:
|
| 8 |
* build and forget, give 0 fucks when attacked
|
8 |
* build and forget, give 0 fucks when attacked
|
| 9 |
* requires 1500 ELO to figure out that shields block damage.
|
9 |
* requires 1500 ELO to figure out that shields block damage.
|
| 10 |
* PROFIT!!!
|
10 |
* PROFIT!!!
|
| 11 |
* A more dps'ish artillery like 2 hammers will not do anything to 4 thugs at all, for free.
|
11 |
* A more dps'ish artillery like 2 hammers will not do anything to 4 thugs at all, for free.
|
| 12 |
\n
|
12 |
\n
|
| 13 |
Same thing with aspis:
|
13 |
Same thing with aspis:
|
| 14 |
* Will drain at 8/50 * 12 = 2 energy/second to regen
|
14 |
* Will drain at 8/50 * 12 = 2 energy/second to regen
|
| 15 |
* will totally block 2 volverines
|
15 |
* will totally block 2 volverines
|
| 16 |
* sounds cheap enough, but also reasonable (i.e. non-free)
|
16 |
* sounds cheap enough, but also reasonable (i.e. non-free)
|
| 17 |
* A more dps'ish unit like hammers will pay for themselves in 26 seconds (!) per hammer used. Thus, if enemy uses aspis - build hammers and win, because if they live 26 seconds each they pay for themselves (at least in energy), with denied OD energy they will pay for themselves in metal as well, maybe in a minute or so.
|
17 |
* A more dps'ish unit like hammers will pay for themselves in 26 seconds (!) per hammer used. Thus, if enemy uses aspis - build hammers and win, because if they live 26 seconds each they pay for themselves (at least in energy), with denied OD energy they will pay for themselves in metal as well, maybe in a minute or so.
|
| 18 |
\n
|
18 |
\n
|
| 19 |
But if GoogleFrog wishes to find a balance issue here - there it is:
|
19 |
But if GoogleFrog wishes to find a balance issue here - there it is:
|
| 20 |
what would be a vehicle counter to the shield ball in 1v1??? Like, really, in a wall vs wall situation, ravagers can kind-of tank felon damage, but you need an overwhelming number of them, which is just not feasible due to roach hazard. Wolverines with their joke DPS need like 4 minutes to pay off vs aspis, and never really break shields. Thugs can tank even solid slasher walls quite comfortable with 1500 HP to spare. So, my counter as vehicles for the shield factory - raid the shit out of your enemy, if not successful resign or facswitch depending on eco and territory available. Great plan huh? And do not suggest domi is a counter to felon - it barely has the range to capture even thugs from ball edge, not mentioning felons in the back.
|
20 |
what would be a vehicle counter to the shield ball in 1v1??? Like, really, in a wall vs wall situation, ravagers can kind-of tank felon damage, but you need an overwhelming number of them, which is just not feasible due to roach hazard. Wolverines with their joke DPS need like 4 minutes to pay off vs aspis, and never really break shields. Thugs can tank even solid slasher walls quite comfortable with 1500 HP to spare. So, my counter as vehicles for the shield factory - raid the shit out of your enemy, if not successful resign or facswitch depending on eco and territory available. Great plan huh? And do not suggest domi is a counter to felon - it barely has the range to capture even thugs from ball edge, not mentioning felons in the back.
|
| 21 |
\n
|
21 |
\n
|
| 22 |
Let us run some more numbers: take the fattest assault in veh factory - ravager. It has 1850 hp, just the same as thug's shield 1200 + HP(!). At 250 metal/ravager, shield player gets 1850 * 160 / 250 = 1184 shield per same metal cost... jees! so thugs actually happen to have same shields/cost as ravagers have HP/cost... o_O so countering thugs with ravagers is hopeless, you are losing units, he is losing free shield charge, units die, shield recharges in 60 seconds...
|
22 |
Let us run some more numbers: take the fattest assault in veh factory - ravager. It has 1850 hp, just the same as thug's shield 1200 + HP(!). At 250 metal/ravager, shield player gets 1850 * 160 / 250 = 1184 shield per same metal cost... jees! so thugs actually happen to have same shields/cost as ravagers have HP/cost... o_O so countering thugs with ravagers is hopeless, you are losing units, he is losing free shield charge, units die, shield recharges in 60 seconds...
|
| 23 |
Let us look at reapers: 6800hp / 850metal = 8 hp/metal, thugs come at 7.8 shield/metal, so suiciding reapers into felons to drain shields is also a joke. What's left? Halberds? Well, that is if you are playing hovers on land of course...
|
23 |
Let us look at reapers: 6800hp / 850metal = 8 hp/metal, thugs come at 7.8 shield/metal, so suiciding reapers into felons to drain shields is also a joke. What's left? Halberds? Well, that is if you are playing hovers on land of course...
|
| 24 |
\n
|
24 |
\n
|
| 25 |
My suggestion - make shield charge non-free!!!
|
25 |
My suggestion - make shield charge non-free!!!
|
| 26 |
Alternatively:
|
26 |
Alternatively:
|
| 27 |
* Make felons shorter-ranged OR
|
27 |
* Make felons shorter-ranged OR
|
| 28 |
* Reduce the DPS (i.e. drain-rate) OR
|
28 |
* Reduce the DPS (i.e. drain-rate) OR
|
| 29 |
* Give impaler tracking to enable sniping of felons.
|
29 |
* Give impaler tracking to enable sniping of felons.
|
|
|
30 |
\n
|
|
|
31 |
@Klon
|
|
|
32 |
The idea of shields that do not regen on their own is actually quite fun... Maybe if free shields would regen TERRIBLY slowly they would be fine? Make Thug regen at 2-3 HP/sec and it will be just as good as assault meatshield but totally useless as static shield generator. Then big shield ball would REQUIRE aspis to reload, but that would not be free. Further, felons could be given somewhat fast 20 hp/sec reload at 6 energy/second, to enable them reasonable solo reload without aspis.
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Shieldbot balance