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@GoogleFrog
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@GoogleFrog
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[q]What exactly is the problem with tactical cloaking?[/q]
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[q]What exactly is the problem with tactical cloaking?[/q]
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For me:
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For me:
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* The uncertainty of enemy forces makes assault raids and raider->arti punishes much scarier, increasing dominance of arti (lance and firewalker in particular), which is the less dynamic part of the game
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* The uncertainty of enemy forces makes assault raids and raider->arti punishes much scarier, increasing dominance of arti (lance and firewalker in particular), which is the less dynamic part of the game
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* Separately from the above, the uncertainty encourages hesitancy, making things more statematey
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* Separately from the above, the uncertainty encourages hesitancy, making things more statematey
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* Not being able to see enemy units (with a bit of scouting effort) means inability to assess enemy force composition and plan around it, removing an interesting minigame (the godlike "assess total battlefield losses and enemy mex overdrive numbers to peer into the fog of war to assess likely amount and composition of cloaked forces in this area" is not a minigame mortal humans can realistically play in team games)
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* Not being able to see enemy units (with a bit of scouting effort) means inability to assess enemy force composition and plan around it, removing an interesting minigame (the godlike "assess total battlefield losses and enemy mex overdrive numbers to peer into the fog of war to assess likely amount and composition of cloaked forces in this area" is not a minigame mortal humans can realistically play in team games)
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* The invisibility substantially increases the role of chance over strategy (e.g. someone's little cloaked ogre ball might just accidentally run into the enemy cloaked lance+mace ball and the game will be decided in a chaotic mess of fire where no players really have much influence over the outcome)
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* The invisibility substantially increases the role of chance over strategy (e.g. someone's little cloaked ogre ball might just accidentally run into the enemy cloaked lance+mace ball and the game will be decided in a chaotic mess of fire where no players really have much influence over the outcome)
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\n
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\n
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(I'm assuming the universalization of cloak across the front line as that's what I often see in the late game when there are a few blues on each side)
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(I'm assuming the universalization of cloak across the front line as that's what I often see in the late game when there are a few blues on each side)
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\n
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\n
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\n
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\n
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[q]I like the idea of a cloak capacity, either soft or hard, but I'm not sure how to make it work. It can't work on unit count because then it just makes people cloak a single Dante rather than a bunch of Kinghts. A threshold based on metal cost or mass feels very numbery.[/q]
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[q]I like the idea of a cloak capacity, either soft or hard, but I'm not sure how to make it work. It can't work on unit count because then it just makes people cloak a single Dante rather than a bunch of Kinghts. A threshold based on metal cost or mass feels very numbery.[/q]
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I
think
@mojjj's
metal
based
approach
of
the
cloaker
shrinking
until
it
covers
the
right
amount
of
metal
may
make
it
intuitively
experimental
enough
to
work.
.
.
🤔
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I
think
@mojjj's
metal
based
approach
of
the
cloaker
shrinking
until
it
covers
the
right
amount
of
metal
may
make
it
intuitively
experimental
enough
to
avoid
the
main
downsides
of
numberiness.
.
.
🤔
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\n
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@Anarchid
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@Anarchid
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[q]The recent thread about smoke missiles could provide another option. Something along these lines:
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[q]The recent thread about smoke missiles could provide another option. Something along these lines:
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- Large Area Cloak replaced with Smoke Field
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- Large Area Cloak replaced with Smoke Field
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- Smoke Field is visible to the enemy, so is explicitly tactical cloak only
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- Smoke Field is visible to the enemy, so is explicitly tactical cloak only
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- Units inside the smoke field also have their vision massively reduced, requiring spotters outside the field for any long range shenanigans
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- Units inside the smoke field also have their vision massively reduced, requiring spotters outside the field for any long range shenanigans
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- Strategic cloak is retained in Conjurer [/q]
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- Strategic cloak is retained in Conjurer [/q]
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This seems like it doesn't solve the issues you list.
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This seems like it doesn't solve the issues you list.
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\n
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\n
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The only one it does solve is cloaked snitch (the downside of things in the fog not being able to see is unlikely to matter in practice with Owls circling ahead or a scythe or flea nearer the enemy).
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The only one it does solve is cloaked snitch (the downside of things in the fog not being able to see is unlikely to matter in practice with Owls circling ahead or a scythe or flea nearer the enemy).
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Opinion: Being able to see the enemy is "cool"