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Title: Zero-K: All Welcome
Host: CZrankSpringiee4
Game version: Zero-K v1.4.3.4
Engine version: 100.0
Battle ID: 410735
Started: 8 years ago
Duration: 24 minutes
Players: 6
Bots: False
Mission: False
Rating: Casual
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Team 1
Chance of victory: 53.2%

CHrankAdminDeinFreund
USrankSpaceTuna
USranktoxicman45
Team 2
Chance of victory: 46.8%

snoke
DErankbamn1
USrankSmoothKing
Spectators
FRrankHelwor
CZrankSpringiee4

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Page of 2 (25 records)
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1. Build Licho
2. Troll enemies with it
3. Sloooowly build bantha
4. Keep trolling with licho
5. ???
6. Profit!


[Spoiler]
+1 / -0

8 years ago
I haven't seen a shadow in years.
It might be time to make shadows great again.
Vamps could use a buff too. They are absolute trash.
+1 / -0
8 years ago
Ravens are still great, but people prefer wyvern's robustness: high hp, so lower risk, doesn't have to dive slowly, has homing rocket (or does it?). Damage/cost is still higher for ravens.
I've used and have seen ravens used for bombing statics, especially eco. Wyverns are good for clusters of expensive units, especially low hp/cost units.
+0 / -0
Skasi
8 years ago
Wyvern has been replacing Raven ever since the Raven nerf. Pretty sure every experienced player knows that, nothing new.
+0 / -0

8 years ago
quote:

Nurf licho so air turns into proper support fac? (Stiletto, Scoutplane & Avengers)

What are shadows for again?


Perhaps Licho should become a limited area of effect EMP plane (+optional implosion), with reduced HP & cost stats. In that case ravens will not need to dive to shoot their target.
+1 / -0

8 years ago
Definitely! Also give phoenix slow damage instead of fire so ravagers can no longer outrun shadows.
+3 / -0


8 years ago
I'd love a glue bomber making a certain area super slow to move on for a while. It could be the other half of the old emp stiletto. :)
+0 / -0
Skasi
1) Bring back Minelayer bomber
2) Give mines slow damage
3) Honk happily

[Spoiler]
+0 / -0

8 years ago
I think raven's should have their dive entirely removed so they can't hit moving targats at all. In return, make them more cost efficient for ruining all things wayward mex.
+2 / -0
Bomber with (destroyable) pulse slow bombs!!!!
+0 / -0
Skasi
quote:
I think raven's should have their dive entirely removed

They wouldn't be able to rearm without the ability to change altitude.

quote:
so they can't hit moving targats at all

They still could, players had to babysit their units to give dodge orders. There's also the option to automate dodging.
+0 / -0


8 years ago
quote:
They still could, players had to babysit their units to give dodge orders.

That was a quick time event because it was quick. Bomb's flight time was under a second, and if i remember correctly, it was also capable of leading target, so you had to change direction very shortly after the bomb was released to travel far enough in another direction to avoid being hit.

A slower projectile, or a non-leading projectile would solve this. Conveniently, Spring's AircraftBomb weapon type is also unable to lead, which is why Shadow originally had this weird missile-based reimplementation: that is something that is necessary for an anti-mobile unit.

Splitting Raven into an anti-unit and an anti-structure unit was proposed a long time ago; the same was also proposed for Wyvern. Both used to basically do the same role: "kill everything", as both are capable of hitting mobile ground, slow air, and statics alike, with minor tradeoffs between damage per cost and weight.

As it is right now, Raven is not effective at killing fast mobiles, so everyone just goes for the generalist of the two: Wyvern. A Raven made even less efficient at generalism will only enforce that further unless Wyvern also loses some of its generalism.
+1 / -0


8 years ago
For some reason Wyvern is faster than Raven. This gives it another advantage over Raven, one that seems backwards. Would much break if Raven became faster than Wyvern?
+0 / -0

8 years ago
Yes.

Either you're speeding up ravens, which IMO would take them over the edge, or you're slowing down wyvern, which could very easily kill it.

But it's worth a go.
+0 / -0
Speeding up High Raven also means speeding up Dive Raven, which extends the class of units that it is capable of hunting down and the retaliatory damage it takes against units previously in that class.

Wyvern could become an assault bomber by gaining some speed in exchange for more hp.
+0 / -0

8 years ago
quote:
Speeding up High Raven also means speeding up Dive Raven

No, why? You can speed up just the High Raven.
+0 / -0


8 years ago
I would rather slow down Wyvern. Slower bombers -> more interaction -> good.
+1 / -1
quote:
by gaining some speed in exchange for more hp.

Uh...uh yea um, I guess I'd take that deal if I really had to. Sounds like a terrible trade-off to make.




I would be in favor of lowering wyvern speed and damage(getting random things 1shot is no fun) for a health boost.
This way it is resistant to static aa, and you need air yourself to hunt it down and kill it(and you can do this because its slower now). Spamming defenders will no longer work!
+1 / -0
With an HP Buff it sounds reasonable. Still, why do you want to make another gunship fac that just has much higher reload times than the real gunships.

Planes are supposed to hit fast and hard. In exchange for that they have to go all the way back to base to reload. That's also why you need different kinds of aa. Razor and Cobra should counter gunships, there's Hacksaw and Chainsaw to counter air.

Sadly this is most of the time overlooked, because CZrankAdminLicho (+Stiletto) is the only unit actually representing airplanes. The other ones are just bad gunships. (In most defensive cases I prefer 5 Rapiers over 5 Shadows)
+0 / -0
Because gunships are the more balanced and fun factory in my opinion.


10 rapiers also cost 2x as much as 5 ravens so....
+0 / -0
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