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Title: [A] Small Teams All Welcome
Host: Nobody
Game version: Zero-K v1.7.9.5
Engine version: 104.0.1-1398-g7442945
Started: 12 days ago
Duration: 23 minutes
Players: 8
Bots: False
Mission: False
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Manual download

Team 1
Chance of victory: 54.8%

ZArankRadavvadra
DErankkatastrophe
USrankrecneps
USrankCHAOSBOSS
Team 2
Chance of victory: 45.2%

GBrankmushroomraider
USrankHavocsquad
USrankSorush
BRrankDiplomatadoCaos

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12 days ago
omg that´s taxing...
+0 / -0

12 days ago
CArankGalamesh i used slings here to fight porc and shield-ball. You are right in that they do their job, they drain shields and if microed kill the porc. But they can`t KILL the shieldballs. The same amount of metal in emmissaries would i think.
This game is a good example of the strenth of cloakies, being able to saturate the whole map with spam of cheap units.
+1 / -0
12 days ago
They're very cheap. You can't expect that much out of them unless you have them in great numbers. I'll watch the replay when I get home.
+1 / -0
keep in mind it was 2:30 nighttime for me :)

PS: i said the same amount of metal in emmissaries would outright kill the balls with their AoE. i am just not sure if this means Sling is UP or (more likely) Emmissary is OP-bullshitery...
+0 / -0
The problem is also that Emissaries can easily kill any number of Slings, while Slings are helpless against them. So if you enter the artillery stage with Slings they'll quickly become paperweights.
+2 / -0
Yah, I said that in a previous discussion. Slings lose vs other artil because they have less range and don't splash. They should splash IMO.

Considering they are low cost and low HP, you also get the whittle down effect of gradually losing your forces instead of keeping full damage potential on a beefier unit until HP reach 0.

In case anyone isn't sure by what I mean by that, what I'm saying is a tremor doesn't lose any damage until it reaches 0 HP, but cost equivalent number of slings gradually lose damage as some of them die for the same amount of damage taken. It's more likely a few slings at a time will die then all of them lose 1 HP, so you'll get picked off instead of just having to repair.

Also they're prone to get destroyed in mass by cheap options like phoenix whereas emissaries, firewalkers, lances, envoys and impalers can survive such hits.

IMO their wiki description is pretty spot on:

quote:
While Slings are not effective against most mobile units due to the low velocity of their projectile, they can still hit large targets such as shields. This makes them a useful soft counter to small quantities of shield bot units, particular the relatively fragile and dangerous Felon. However, when encountered in larger groups linked Shield bot regeneration will be too high to overcome and the Slings will likely become ineffective.


EDIT: Also slings are HORRIBLE at shooting at things at higher elevation.
+0 / -0
DDUUUUUUDDDEE!

Are you kidding me? So first thing is you're fighting on 2 fronts so I was like I get it if you don't do that well. That move VS mushroom's spiders? Take the redbacks with ronins and swing by with glaives to raid recluse? Oh yah that's what I'm talkin' about.

For the sling thing, at least in this game, I don't think the problem was sling vs shields. You were tearing the shields down so much they could never walk forward. But the shields were assisted by 7 phantoms and you were alone holding the south front. Remove the phantoms from that equasion and I think that in that game you're just taking center field by yourself. It was clearly the right counter as far as I can tell.

Not sure why you're thinking this game didn't go that well for you. It was pretty great from what I can tell. Yah your raiders didn't do much and died at the beginning, but you were busy fighting mushroom in the hills so that's fine. And about a third into the game you had a few low cost raids that dealt great damage.
+1 / -0
this game went very well for me. (although it´s not that relaxing to do that at 2:30 you know?)
but what actually killed the shieldball were the likhos. in the end, you don´t need them depleted, you need them ded :D
also:
-big map, so i can use mobility
-2 coms
-reliable and very useful allies

+0 / -0

11 days ago
Slings are perfect light artillery in a sense that they can reliably take out porc like lotuses and pickets without needing to invest 600+ metal into artillery and their DPS for cost is better than other artillery units. It is basically the best artillery unit against single static targets granted the range is enough and the slow speed of 49 won't get you killed.

However, they lack any form of AoE, have short range for artillery and slow projectile speed which means they lose against other artillery units and have trouble hitting any moving land units.

Sling is pretty similar to Impaler as static killer, but has more DPS per cost over range. Higher Alpha units also have easier time getting through shields, granted slings are faster at reducing the shield charge with their higher DPS per cost as long as they hit.

It is also good to note, that for single sling to make cost, you must 2 or more light porc units like lotus or picket. So if you are making 10+ slings, your opponent would need to invest at least that much in porc before slings can even reliably pay themselves back as they really don't perform well against anything else other than porc while general artillery units like Emissary aren't strictly limited to killing porc and other statistics.
+0 / -0

8 days ago
Sling is definitely underpowered, or maybe just overpriced.
+0 / -0
Each time i see Emissary deployed in a a game it immediately proceeds to kill units.

Sling may be UP, but Emissary is insanely powerful compared to other non-strider artillery units.

If you are talking about what other artillery could kill a shieldball for the same cost, can you name even one? Merlin perhaps?

Sling: observed negative
Phantom: Maybe? It will take forever, of course
Racketeer: incapable of murder
Badger: doubtful
Impaler: will probably miss a Thug shield, and even if it drains the shield, it won't hit the units
Firewalker: splashes harmlessly against any shieldball with an Aspis. Splashes gently against shieldballs without.
Tremor: lives in the same fac as Emissary
Envoy: is a sea emissary
Merlin: probably can, but that's a bit of an investment
Shogun: Ditto

Am i forgetting anything? Cerberus and Bertha?
+1 / -0

8 days ago
You forgot Lance and Lobster.
+0 / -0


8 days ago
Lance is second best anti-unit artillery and could actually work.

Lobster doesn't do any damage on its own, so i don't think it's an option here.
+0 / -0

8 days ago
My memorable replay featuring Lance vs Shields:

http://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/560256

Felt like in passive showdown (just accumulating units) Lance wins - but shield player has lots of time to take initiative to change the situation.
+0 / -0