tanks nerf\rework

The passive gameplay is the weakness.

I'd put tanks slightly below average as a factory, and both Blitz and Minotaur below average as units. Often a team will have a lead of several thousand army value, but crumple under pressure anyway because too much of that army is Minotaurs. Blitz, on the other hand, can do well for themselves by setting up hit-and-runs and using their stuns to escape repercussions; however, this is skill intensive if you want it to justify Blitzes' hefty price tag, and using autoretreat is just asking for it to punish you by dropping a stunlock.

The Tank Foundry isn't so bad as a factory to demand buffs. But I'd oppose any attempt to nerf Blitz or Minotaur in particular.

Tanks are strong, like all factories and can be countered easily, like all factories.

The basic challenge is anticipating the overall pattern of the enemy and exploiting it in the right moment. A wild mix of having intel and your available units at the right place. To have the knowledge is something completely different then actually applying it ingame.

Thanks are slow & expensive!

The average bot factory allows you to be all over the map, seeding destruction & distraction to the enemy, while gaining intel at the same time. There are various counters.

Naming a view, given there are more:

- Cloakbot. Have some Imps all over the place. Spam Reaver & Ronin. Don't suicide, press forward and repair units. Always good to raid with Glaives and be everywhere to keep them busy. Mono-spam Knights.

- Spider Mono-spam Recluse. Mono-spam Venom. Or get a mix of Venom & Redback. Mono-spam hermits. Stun with widow units out of place the get them with fleas

- Shieldbot Mono-spam Rogue. Mono-spam Dirtbag. Have some snitches all over the place. Or crush them slowly with Felon, Thug, Outlaw, Racketeer and 1-2 shields. You might play round to get the right mix

- Hover Scalpel + Mace. Like ratio 3-4 more scalpels then mace. Scalpel will destroy those heavy tanks, while mace keeps them at at distance. Or mono-spam Halberd push via some available pathing to the base or meaningful eco, to buy some time to go for something else or exploit this

- Jumpbot Keep tanks at distance with Placeholder, while pushing forward and kill everything with Moderator. Mono-spam Puppies. Get Jacks and rip everything apart. Be everywhere and raid stuff with a bunch of Pyros. Throw some tanks around with Jugglenaut. With the right timing Skuttle is very usefull against tanks as well

- Amphbot Slow them down with Limpets and clean it up with Duck & Scallop. Mono-spam Buoy. Later on Grizzly is also very effective. Use Lobster to throw either some tanks around, depending on the map in water or lava or some holes. Or throw your own units on tanks, with Limpets. Or throw tanks out of position and kill them

- Gunship Spam Gnats, stun tanks and kill them with Locust & Harpy. Keep them at distance and kill them with Nimbus. Mono-spam Harpy, slow them down and kill them. Revenant kill tanks in a reasonable way

Having written above, keep in mind the game pattern is a moving target and changing constantly. It's an adaption race. Depending on the setup a usual legit counter/unit composition might not a good idea. I recommend 1:1 to play around.

I agree with @fumica, blitz is expensive, and it kinda dies to a lot of things. If anything thing should be changed I think that it's koda, their ability to just kill everything chasing them means that they become a nightmare to micro against. They are not necessarily over powered, but the way they function is aggravating; but thats just me.

Blitz costs more than most riots.

I'm directly contesting your "zero effort" claim on Blitzes. Blitzes are skill intensive units. They rely on good judgment to pick fights where they outnumber the enemy and disengage at the right time, and at least decent army control to distribute the stun output and to avoid getting wrecked by splashes. Without either, the ball tends to do well for a bit but then take a fair fight against stuff with real DPS and get decimated, or just lose a ton of tempo by taking unnecessary damage and spending most of its time repairing. As the heaviest raider on land, a Blitz ball can be deceptively threatening, but that's because it's deceptively expensive also, hence why it does poorly when it's outnumbered in a fight with nigh equal costs.

Minotaur, on the other hand, represents a known difference of opinion between myself and the both the mainstream meta and some dedicated Minotaur fans. I assess it as one of the least cost-effective and over-used units in the game despite some theoretical strengths; the best review I can give for it is that if a teammate quits and leaves me with some Minotaurs then they might be worth more in combat then as live reclaim for the Cyclops, Artillery and Strider fund. I'm the wrong person to present its strengths in general, because I do not value them highly. You do have a point in that, as fast assaults like Ravagers, they have an archetype advantage against slow skirms like Recluse. But I've been consistently frustrated in every attempt to use them - between their poor damage output for such an expensive unit and their downtime for repairs and the cost of forward infrastructure, it's pretty easy to punish a Minotaur user with constant pressure even when the Minotaurs themselves look like they're taking decent trades when they do fight.


Finally, I'd claim that it's healthy for the big teams game for the fast assaults and heavy raiders to be comparatively strong. Big teams have a tendency to degenerate into porc lines lobbing the longest ranged artillery available at each other. Once that's happened, a mass of fast assaults or heavy raiders is one of the few things that can shift the game back into one of strong dynamic plays even if they're ultimately limited by their inability to take Antinukes with them.

Is your claim that they're only overpowered in the hands of players who are worse than you are, but not particularly so in the hands of a silver+ player?