there we go: https://github.com/ZeroK-RTS/Zero-K-Infrastructure/issues/796I do not see the reason to not implement it. Not implementing is much more worse than having FFA counting into teams elo. Please no suggestions to make no FFA elo. There are some epic FFA players and some noobs in FFA and it is very different to teams play and 1 vs 1. I really see no reason why not have seperated FFA elo. Is it so hard to implement? There is also PW elo which could be put into teams... why no FFA elo?
+5 / -0
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Will it be considered blasphemy to add also FFA elo to players (and relative ladder too)?
+0 / -0
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Also need a separate 2v2 ladder, a separate 4v4 ladder, and a separate ladder for people who defeat CAI without losing any units. Is the FFA ladder proposal meant to be purely competitive, or help with balance somehow? If so, then how?
+3 / -3
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Purely competetive from implementation point of view. But it will still help FFA balance, because the beauty of FFA is that it balances itself, player who appears too strong is more likely to get ganged from start (assuming the other players are competent enough).
+2 / -0
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Aside from integrating into zk proper, you could just have a standalone ladder on a standardized platform, e.g. like Wesnoth do for their ranked games.
+0 / -0
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there should be small teams ladder as well: 2vs2 up to 4vs4 if Firepluk in any team do not count....
+0 / -1
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quote:
Is the FFA ladder proposal meant to be purely competitive, or help with balance somehow? If so, then how? |
For Team FFA. And to keep FFAs from falsifying team elo. The question is always if the improvement is worth the complexity, but there will be a little improvement. quote:
Also need a separate 2v2 ladder, a separate 4v4 ladder, and a separate ladder for people who defeat CAI without losing any units. |
quote:
there should be small teams ladder as well:
2vs2 up to 4vs4 |
You wouldn't even need seperate elos for every team size. You could just use a weighted average of 1v1 elo and team elo and its changes depending on team sizes. If n is the average team size (2.5 in a 2v3) you would use 1v1elo/n+(1-1/n)*teamelo. Just a random idea.
+1 / -0
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What is the balance feature of ELO in 1vs1??? It still exist What is the point of have team ELO when we all sit in a clusterfuck room?? It still exist
+0 / -0
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In the future, the 1v1 Elo will give you a partner at your skill level. Currently it's mostly swag which is also important though because ZK is hardcore and competitive. In the future, teamgame Elo will make the people in your game have your skill level. Currently it attempts to make sure the halves of the clusterfuck are reasonably equal which is pretty important too.
+0 / -0
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So in the future FFA elo can provide me with opponents of my skill level for FFA games?
+3 / -0
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I remember trying to play FFA matchmaking in Wings of Liberty at the peak of its popularity. I queued for an hour, and then finally got a game with three players (presumably in cahoots) who all instantly resigned. Dunno if FFA matchmaking will be viable. Community here is probably different tho.
+0 / -0
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Apparently SC2 ditched FFA matchmaking altogether recently because almost nobody played it. With ZK it would probably be even worse not just because of lower playercount, but also because ZK FFAs tend to be large -- the SC2 version had only 4 people and still it was too hard to find so few. I'd say FFA MM is not worth it. That does not mean a separate FFA Elo can't exist but then it would be good if Elo was only available through official hosts. Perhaps FFA could just be an exception.
+0 / -0
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In my opinion FFA Elo makes more sense than PW Elo (which we already have).
+0 / -0
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No need for yet another elo value - the simplest way is to make FFA games not affect elo. Team FFA games (games where one or more team has >1 player) could still affect team elo as they do now.
+1 / -0
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quote:
In my opinion FFA Elo makes more sense than PW Elo |
Excellent. Remove PW Elo. If PW is to have some ladder, it should not be Elo but something related to PW itself, for example planets captured, influence gained, or orbital bombing megadeths.
+0 / -0
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PW elo exists because PW needs (needed?) a balance component, and because using all-elo in PW led to people tanking their elo in off-PW games to get easier PW games.
+1 / -0
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Hardcore 2v2 PW has no balancing. Besides, tanking Elo was an orthogonal problem. It's not like doing that is allowed outside PW either.
+0 / -0
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I support separate elo for FFA and there is many players who said it too. Teams and FFA isn't same. Future gaming in Zk is too slick term because our community is too small..
+3 / -0
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