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Map: Nuclear_Winter_v1
 Nuclear_Winter_v1
Title: [A] Teams All Welcome
Host: Nobody
Game version: Zero-K v1.9.4.3
Engine version: 104.0.1-1544-ge1f249f
Battle ID: 1117838
Started: 3 years ago
Duration: 18 minutes
Players: 22
Bots: False
Mission: False
Rating: Casual
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Team 1 Lost
Chance of victory: 35.8%
XP gained: 52
USrankDave[tB] died in 17 minutes
PLrankizirayd died in 18 minutes
NLrankswappan died in 18 minutes
CNranksdfasdf died in 18 minutes
ROrankForgotten died in 18 minutes
KRrankFlyingstar died in 18 minutes
RUrankOntheheavens died in 18 minutes
BRrankHerus died in 18 minutes
RUrankeinwindir died in 18 minutes
FRranksaru died in 18 minutes
LTrankMaway2000 died in 18 minutes
Team 2 Won!
Chance of victory: 64.2%
XP gained: 60
SErankPLT_Godde
DErankHoppili
AUrank4hundred
USrankpatrician
CNrankdiligentdolphin
unknownrankbinko
DErankzini
INrankTheWarning
RUrankPrototypestill
USrankstrikeshadow
RUrankprapor95
Spectators
USrankAmnykon
AUrankAdminAquanim
GBrankBLaNKMiND
unknownrankPLT_LowTaperFade
IDrankrifqifajarzain
DErankmike3




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PLrankizirayd
3 years ago
Why is a lobster capable of killing a crab, which costs 1600 metal? This damn unit destroys the balance. What is especially stupid is that the jack gets a double jump, breaks the building and runs away. Turrets become useless
+1 / -0
USrankDave[tB]
3 years ago
It seems that Godde now will play any combination of the holy trinity of jack - charon - lobster.
+4 / -0
RUrankOntheheavens
3 years ago
I would argue that widow is also able to kill crab in some circumstances. The question here is how preventable and how much counterplay this unit allows. Widow is easily defeatable by escort.

Multiple lobsters and flying jacks need counters that are very metal-expensive, much more than widow-counters are. I agree that there needs to be some sort of clear counter to lobster if we are operating in rock-paper-scissor game still.
+1 / -0

USrankOflameo
3 years ago
(edited 3 years ago)
What properties would a counter to flying Jacks and Lobsters have?

I would say it would have the ability to spike flying non air-units into into the ground, creating a crater to contain them.

EDIT: A Newton widget could do everything except the crater part.
+0 / -0

PLrankAdminSprung
3 years ago
Cheap (to be cost efficient vs lobster), huge DPS (to deal with the lobster before it can throw the crab), all-terrain (to reach a lobster thrown at a crab spike).

Gnat?
+3 / -0

DErankAdminmojjj
3 years ago
Gnat.
+1 / -0
RUrankOntheheavens
3 years ago
I would be cautious of any sort of flying counters, because they tend to get shut down awfullly easy as well.

My alternative of Gnat is either Venoms, Knights or Racketeer. Knights are probably optimal. Not cheap, but is worthy to have regardless as a generalist.
+1 / -0


EErankAdminAnarchid
3 years ago
(edited 3 years ago)
quote:
Knights are probably optimal. Not cheap, but is worthy to have regardless as a generalist.

The real problem with Knight is that the attacker has the initiative, and will simply attack elsewhere. Gnats work by being a global counter, fast enough to intercept a jack strike anywhere, unless the defender is sleeping.

This does come with a downside of being hard to use in a contested airspace. But i haven't seen Knights being a good defense in practice; i've been countered with Gnat often enough.
+0 / -0