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Metal doodads should be removed competitive maps

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unknownrankspaceT
4 years ago
Metal doodads are those map artifacts that one can reclaim at the beginning of the game to boost your metal income far beyond what mexes can produce. This is what ruined supreme commander for many players as when that game first came out only those players "in the know" knew to rush to the center of the map to reclaim the 5000 metal experimental spider bot. It turned a lot of players off from the game and to some extent having these map artifacts that only players "in the know" can exploit provide an artificial advantage over players that only know to expand normally. I am not saying they should be removed completely however have them provide a paltry amount of metal and have it provide energy instead like trees. All I'm saying is I want to lose fairly, not because I didn't research the metal spots for the new maps that get cycled through the map pool. /rant
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unknownrankShaman
4 years ago
(edited 4 years ago)
F4 and select a con exists.
Start with economy map on: exists.
General knowledge synthesis (rocks == $, trees = $): exists.
Ctrl+Area Reclaim: Exists.

There are more tools in zk than supcom.
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AUrankAdminGoogleFrog
4 years ago
It is notable that the most reliably popular 1v1 maps don't have metal features.
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BRrankManored
4 years ago
(edited 4 years ago)
Can't say I have seen maps where I felt they were a problem, although some maps could definitely make them more obvious. Tangerine has a bunch of rocks that are all in out-of-the-way locations.

I played Supcom recently-ish and the lack of an area reclaim is painful =)
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PLrankAdminSprung
4 years ago
It could be good to have a menu that allows to views the various points of interest on the map (pre-game but possibly also during). The campaign already places custom markers on things like "go here" or "destroy this" and something similar would be desireable eg. for Planet Wars (see https://github.com/ZeroK-RTS/Zero-K/issues/2136 "list of structures") so it might as well have an eco tab listing the various reclaim options and others.

+5 / -0

AUrankAdminAquanim
4 years ago
(edited 4 years ago)
unknownrankspaceT which current maps in the competitive map pool have a meaningful amount of metal in rocks and the like?

(This question is partly to calibrate what you think a meaningful amount of metal is. I don't remember any competitive maps with 5000 metal reclaim though.)
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unknownrankShaman
4 years ago
quote:


Why is the top northern dick bigger than the bottom southern dick?
[Spoiler]
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BRrankManored
4 years ago
(edited 4 years ago)
Incidentally, it would be nice if the area reclaim command ignored energy reclaim by default. I know its not completely useless to reclaim energy but I often give area reclaim commands so that my builders will eat rocks or wrecks and later find out the're eating nearby trees instead. This is specially aggravating in maps with lots of trees such as Small Supreme Battlefield.
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AUrankAdminGoogleFrog
4 years ago
A setting exists to toggle that BRrankManored. Also there is a modifier key to hold. I'm not changing the default because it should be possible to area-reclaim for energy without searching through the settings.
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USranknop
4 years ago
(edited 4 years ago)
Maybe op is referring to Multiplayer B871398 2 on Hourglass v0.3

On this map the metal features are especially tiny and impossible to see during deployment when zoomed out, I never would have noticed if not for replay vision of Dregs sucking them up with Wasps. There's thousands of metal out there in scattered clusters. Even after game starts and a con is selected to highlight, some of the metal features disappear when zoomed all the way out.

Whatever you think of the mechanic, the execution of these rocks is bad.

Reclaimable metal features don't have consistent visuals across maps beyond the "flashes when a con is selected". If this is going to be part of ZK, having some prefabs with consistent visuals would make it a lot more obvious what's going on (think green tiberium field or clump of blue minerals). Otherwise this map probably works fine if the metal features are scaled up or just deleted for now.
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AUrankAdminGoogleFrog
4 years ago
I agree that those rocks should be a lot larger for how much metal is in them.
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EErankAdminAnarchid
4 years ago
Hourglass also suffers from this badly. In 1v1 you can contain the enemy away from mexes, but with some radars they can just merrily reclaim and duck off when raiders come.

Generally i think maps should not have more than 1000 or even 500 total reclaim.

If i ever gather steam to touch up Thornford i would slash its reclaim 2x or so.
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