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Reef buff when?

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3 months ago
Since im getting accused of beeing a troll for just attempting to bulid a Reef i think its time to reopen that forgotten barrel with the label "Reef" again.

https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1424458
Im sure unknownrankTinySpider can help me in this to elaborate why Reef is underpowered and in need of a long needed Buff.

Id say the Drones are too fragile and only 10 sec of effect for a paid missile is too short.
+3 / -0
quote:
Since im getting accused of beeing a troll for just attempting to bulid a Reef

in Otago
+3 / -0

3 months ago
REEF HAS ITS USES !

https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1419400

+0 / -0
3 months ago
@BLANKMIND
even in that game Reefs infulence is best descibed as "mental damage".
+0 / -0
2,111,011 DISARM VALUE IS INSANE !

THE PROBLEM YOU HAVE IS THAT U ONLY BUILD BIG UNITS, YOU NEED A ARMY TOO.... (U CAN'T RELY ON YOUR TEAM MATES TO BE ON THE SAME PAGE AS YOU)

SHIELD + SHIP SPAM IS SEA META...

REEF COUNTERS IT VERY WELL !

I JUST FORGET TO BUILD THEM !

#PAAARAAAATAAAANKBOOOOAAAATS !
+6 / -0
The problem I have with buffing Reef is that:
  • every time a unit has been strong on the basis of its drones, it has seemed to be bad for the game
  • the manual fire of Reef is already pretty decent in the right situation, and making a second sea unit even more reliant on its stockpiling manual fire is stepping on Scylla's toes
  • it's not obvious how to make a unit defined as a carrier strong based on something other than the first two points
+1 / -0

3 months ago
could we at least do something about the landing pads? such slow repair rate, lichos stuck there forever...
+6 / -0
3 months ago
I honestly like the drones, it gives a challenge you don't usually encounter. They're fast and you can't just hit them with land units. Also I think the models are pretty and that should be reason to keep them.

I recently played a campaign mission (Sirlanna) where each objective had drones guarding it, and I couldn't just run in with a grizzly swarm. They were too slow and heavy to catch them and I had to retreat often to get more fly swatters.
+0 / -0
Dude you've built a reef on a LAND MAP, you dug a hole to water level and built a reef in middle of land. Reef is bad enough on water but you took it to another level. I was on the opposing team and YOUR TEAM started the kick when I pointed it out how you sabotaged them.
+0 / -0

3 months ago
quote:
could we at least do something about the landing pads? such slow repair rate, lichos stuck there forever...

Yes that's a great idea! Make the repair pads heal/rearm faster! Then in that case there is actually a reason to use Reef's landing pads, since there are only two, and you don't usually already have a bunch of caretakers nearby your reef to help repair your planes.
+3 / -0
3 months ago
Maybe the you could make the reef build cheaper air units that can only be used near the reef. This would have more of a expendable tactical air thing, but you need to get close. It can also be used for the support of an army, or attacking nearby shores.

It also just vibes with being a carrier.
+2 / -0
3 months ago
I like that idea, maybe small swift-like planes which can also do kamikaze for heavier damage?
Or maybe mutliple kinds of air which can be built?
A limit to the amount of crafts should exist though, so it cant just be used as a mobile air factory.
+0 / -0
3 months ago
Just make the landing pads actually useful. A normal pad is pretty useless without a bunch of caretakers to repair.
So if it could repair / rearm bombers in a few seconds that would be great. (It needs to be pretty fast since there are only 2 pads) Thinking like a 2x or 3x increase in rearm and 4x repair speed.
+3 / -0
3 months ago
quote:
reef build cheaper air units

You begin casting...

quote:
can only be used near the reef.

Too much dev mana usage!

Spell failed.

A less intensive option presents itself deeper within, will you peer deeper? [y/n]

!y

You look deeper and find the answer you have been looking for.

Learnt how to cast High hp Low dps Drones!

+2 / -0

3 months ago
quote:
High hp Low dps Drones!

Free damage sinks sounds like it is probably going to be a balance/design problem.
+1 / -0


3 months ago
Speeding up the repair/rearm speed significantly sounds fine.
+10 / -0

3 months ago
can we also have a "force release planes" button like discussed in https://github.com/ZeroK-RTS/Zero-K/issues/3971

why are planes unable to comply to move commands anyway while reloading?
+2 / -0
3 months ago
I started to experimenting with the reef a few times ago, and I don't see the problem with it. It's sometimes hard to use, and I still don't understand how you make the drones attack or not, and what (or are they independant ?).
+1 / -0
3 months ago
quote:
Free damage sinks sounds like it is probably going to be a balance/design problem.


Good point, imagine if you got a nimbus behind one of these drones.

Can you change targeting priority maybe to help with this?
+0 / -0
Free damage sink? That is what shields do right?



One simple modification to reef I'd like tried is splitting the disarm damage into much smaller chunks like (disarm 150x 100 hits) as opposed to penetrating shields. This enables effective shield drain without hitting the shield generator directly.

Shield spam on sea is really quite lame to fight... I have yet to try hardcore limpet spam, but from what I've seen people just can't deal with it.
+0 / -0
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