| 1 |
[q]While technically it is correct (as it depends on what units "are air"), game-play wise space jacks (or pyros) seem to me the worst offender to the idea of "unambiguous".[/q]
|
1 |
[q]While technically it is correct (as it depends on what units "are air"), game-play wise space jacks (or pyros) seem to me the worst offender to the idea of "unambiguous".[/q]
|
| 2 |
Anything other than the current system is much more complicated than having AA only shoot at air.
|
2 |
Anything other than the current system is much more complicated than having AA only shoot at air.
|
| 3 |
\n
|
3 |
\n
|
| 4 |
Say you decide something has to be "flying" to be targetted by AA. There is no clear line to draw.
|
4 |
Say you decide something has to be "flying" to be targetted by AA. There is no clear line to draw.
|
| 5 |
* Do Lobbed units fly?
|
5 |
* Do Lobbed units fly?
|
| 6 |
* What about jumpjets?
|
6 |
* What about jumpjets?
|
| 7 |
* Units dropped from transports?
|
7 |
* Units dropped from transports?
|
| 8 |
* How about a Knight that hits a Jugglenaut and bounces up to Krow height?
|
8 |
* How about a Knight that hits a Jugglenaut and bounces up to Krow height?
|
| 9 |
* How about the little jump Buoy does when it pops out of the water?
|
9 |
* How about the little jump Buoy does when it pops out of the water?
|
| 10 |
* What about any unit pulled by Jugglenaut, or pushed off a cliff? How high does the cliff have to be?
|
10 |
* What about any unit pulled by Jugglenaut, or pushed off a cliff? How high does the cliff have to be?
|
| 11 |
* A Dante that is pushed and hits a small bump?
|
11 |
* A Dante that is pushed and hits a small bump?
|
| 12 |
* At the lower end we have anything that skids a bit after being hit by a Ripper.
|
12 |
* At the lower end we have anything that skids a bit after being hit by a Ripper.
|
| 13 |
If the answer to any of these questions is 'yes', then figuring out whether AA will shoot at something becomes untenably arcane or complicated. Sure, we probably have more arcane mechanics, but complication needs to be in proportion to the outcome variance, with the variance here coming from how random a system looks to the uninitiated.
|
13 |
If the answer to any of these questions is 'yes', then figuring out whether AA will shoot at something becomes untenably arcane or complicated. Sure, we probably have more arcane mechanics, but complication needs to be in proportion to the outcome variance, with the variance here coming from how random a system looks to the uninitiated.
|
| 14 |
\n
|
14 |
\n
|
| 15 |
So what is the outcome variance? AA has range, and air tends not to be in its range, so nearby AA is going to hammer anything that qualifies itself for targeting. There is no clear line to draw. Different ways of ending up in the air can launch units to quite a variety of heights. Is Artemis to become the new counter to Recon Comm, or do we cut out jumpjets? What about jumpjets from space, what is 'space? And what happens when the AA needs to home into a unit that reached the ground since its peek? Low thresholds, anything in the actual range that aircraft fly at (remember, Jack can melee Nimbus), are just going to be silly.
|
15 |
So what is the outcome variance? AA has range, and air tends not to be in its range, so nearby AA is going to hammer anything that qualifies itself for targeting. There is no clear line to draw. Different ways of ending up in the air can launch units to quite a variety of heights. Is Artemis to become the new counter to Recon Comm, or do we cut out jumpjets? What about jumpjets from space, what is 'space? And what happens when the AA needs to home into a unit that reached the ground since its peek? Low thresholds, anything in the actual range that aircraft fly at (remember, Jack can melee Nimbus), are just going to be silly.
|
| 16 |
\n
|
16 |
\n
|
| 17 |
Higher thresholds are janky, but in a much more reasonable way. It would be one of my last resort considerations if I thought Newton ramp really needed a nerf. And this would become adversarial, since I would expect people to optimise for low-flying Newton ramps if given a good enough reason to do so. Such a mechanic would still be a [i]cost[/i] that other considerations would need to make worth paying, not a benefit. And it would be more ugly than what we have at the moment. Why does a Jack have to fly twice as high as a Nimbus for AA to shoot it, when Locust basically hugs the ground?
|
17 |
Higher thresholds are janky, but in a much more reasonable way. It would be one of my last resort considerations if I thought Newton ramp really needed a nerf. And this would become adversarial, since I would expect people to optimise for low-flying Newton ramps if given a good enough reason to do so. Such a mechanic would still be a [i]cost[/i] that other considerations would need to make worth paying, not a benefit. And it would be more ugly than what we have at the moment. Why does a Jack have to fly twice as high as a Nimbus for AA to shoot it, when Locust basically hugs the ground?
|
| 18 |
\n
|
18 |
\n
|
|
|
19 |
So I have yet to hear any answer to "When can AA shoot a Pyro?" that is anywhere near as good as "No".
|
Artemis ruins air lategame