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@B2498478
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@B2498478
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Do we agree that potato's com in the isolated alcove would have died to any raider in that metal value? Two players' worth of raiders (bandits + locust) vs one engicom. After that ninse sent his engicom too far ahead alone and died to one player's worth of raiders while trying to back out and the locusts didn't even participate in that fight. I am not sure that match proves anything about locust, other than maybe ground raiders might have blown up with the enemy engicom while locusts did not?
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Do we agree that potato's com in the isolated alcove would have died to any raider in that metal value? Two players' worth of raiders (bandits + locust) vs one engicom. After that ninse sent his engicom too far ahead alone and died to one player's worth of raiders while trying to back out and the locusts didn't even participate in that fight. I am not sure that match proves anything about locust, other than maybe ground raiders might have blown up with the enemy engicom while locusts did not?
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Losing the first com was a pretty hard blow to both income and expansion potential.
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Losing the first com was a pretty hard blow to both income and expansion potential.
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Map presence was a thing though. I'll concede that ground raiders might have taken more time to reach coolcat's engicom pushing on the opposite side alcove at the end of the match, but I think there was already a significant lead for south at that point so anything in that metal difference would have done the trick.
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Map presence was a thing though. I'll concede that ground raiders might have taken more time to reach coolcat's engicom pushing on the opposite side alcove at the end of the match, but I think there was already a significant lead for south at that point so anything in that metal difference would have done the trick.
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@B2498497
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@B2498497
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First encounter is glaives vs locust deep into south territory (glaive aggression) and the trade is nowhere near even as the locust eat dirt (520 lost in glaives to 660 lost in locust) while the locust ball value is nearly double and even has some bandit support at the end.
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First encounter is glaives vs locust deep into south territory (glaive aggression) and the trade is nowhere near even as the locust eat dirt (520 lost in glaives to 660 lost in locust) while the locust ball value is nearly double and even has some bandit support at the end.
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At 4:19 locusts kill an engicom and lose 900 value for the privilege. Again, considering how far exposed the engicom was, same value of any raider could have done exactly the same.
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At 4:19 locusts kill an engicom and lose 900 value for the privilege. Again, considering how far exposed the engicom was, same value of any raider could have done exactly the same.
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At 5:45, 1900 worth of locust kill 300ish worth of glaives after running from them in the first place and letting the glaives destroy a factory, 2 mexes and a light amount of other stuff. It's literally on top of an ally factory, so any unit could have responded to the glaive threat.
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At 5:45, 1900 worth of locust kill 300ish worth of glaives after running from them in the first place and letting the glaives destroy a factory, 2 mexes and a light amount of other stuff. It's literally on top of an ally factory, so any unit could have responded to the glaive threat.
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At 8:00 the locust engage a shieldball backed by gremlins protecting mid map. The locust eat dirt and kill nothing. South dies. I don't see what this match shows about what locust did. I do wonder though if that locust ball from 5:00 to 8:00 would have spent raiding lightly protected expansion from the edge of the map on the east edge, how would north have responded? At that point the pretty much only aa north had was 8 or so gremlins that happened to be where the locust were all the time. What if locust had used its flight to hit mexes instead and clean right edge of the map? I also wonder what if north's plane had gotten 2 or so raptors... just about the only use case where raptors are quite good. The 3 early swifts did nothing to the locust other than lightly tickle and then endanger themselves.
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At 8:00 the locust engage a shieldball backed by gremlins protecting mid map. The locust eat dirt and kill nothing. South dies. I don't see what this match shows about what locust did. I do wonder though if that locust ball from 5:00 to 8:00 would have spent raiding lightly protected expansion from the edge of the map on the east edge, how would north have responded? At that point the pretty much only aa north had was 8 or so gremlins that happened to be where the locust were all the time. What if locust had used its flight to hit mexes instead and clean right edge of the map? I also wonder what if north's plane had gotten 2 or so raptors... just about the only use case where raptors are quite good. The 3 early swifts did nothing to the locust other than lightly tickle and then endanger themselves.
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@B2498511
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@B2498511
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Locust spend the first 3 minutes flying around the enemy base and being a nusance. They don't actually kill anything other than a half built mex, but to the enemy team they probably feel like a significant threat. The locust retreat without losses and a 1.05 attrition damage ratio. Psychological damage?
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Locust spend the first 3 minutes flying around the enemy base and being a nusance. They don't actually kill anything other than a half built mex, but to the enemy team they probably feel like a significant threat. The locust retreat without losses and a 1.05 attrition damage ratio. Psychological damage?
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Ending at 4:30 there was a locust raid that took out a few mexes but made the attrition damage&kill fall from 1 to 0.7 while the spectators comment that run looks scary. Mexes were sniped, but nothing else died and a copious amount of reclaim was left behind.
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Ending at 4:30 there was a locust raid that took out a few mexes but made the attrition damage&kill fall from 1 to 0.7 while the spectators comment that run looks scary. Mexes were sniped, but nothing else died and a copious amount of reclaim was left behind.
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At
5:15
coolcat
with
a
couple
of
pyros
and
blxssom
with
locust
push
on
a
kill
a
guardian
com
reinforced
by
3
venoms.
The
com
dies
yet
the
push
loses
about
equal
value.
It's
the
same
part
of
the
map
the
locust
were
at
previously,
so
flight
and
speed
don't
really
explain
it.
It's
just
two
players
pushing
with
greater
value
upon
a
lightly
protected
com.
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At
5:15
coolcat
with
a
couple
of
pyros
and
blxssom
with
locust
push
on
and
kill
a
guardian
com
reinforced
by
3
venoms.
The
com
dies
yet
the
push
loses
about
equal
value.
It's
the
same
part
of
the
map
the
locust
were
at
previously,
so
flight
and
speed
don't
really
explain
it.
It's
just
two
players
pushing
with
greater
value
upon
a
lightly
protected
com.
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At this point east is 2k metal produced behind, I think entirely explained by the fact that coolcat (with locust support) is facing off vs gounson and is controlling a supermex while east lost the equivalent supermext up north, not because of locust but rather due to spiders I think? I missed it I was looking at the locust.
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At this point east is 2k metal produced behind, I think entirely explained by the fact that coolcat (with locust support) is facing off vs gounson and is controlling a supermex while east lost the equivalent supermext up north, not because of locust but rather due to spiders I think? I missed it I was looking at the locust.
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At 6:00 blxssom catches out of position bolas mid map and restores his attrition kills to 1.0.
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At 6:00 blxssom catches out of position bolas mid map and restores his attrition kills to 1.0.
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Nothing at all happens with locust until 10:00. Potato punches a hole through the north front and Blxssom piggibacks where the resistance is 1 grizzly and 1 razor. 5k value in locuts vs 2.2. East was around 4k metal army deficit before the dive and multiple fronts are suddently contested at the same time with overwhelming force on each. Steelblue vs doctorche, coolcat vs gounson, potato vs chonkgoose and potato's recluse thinning out chonk's amphs pretty much the entire match. It's an all around disaster for east at this point. I don't think the locust did anything because they were locust here. Blxssom just picked encounters that were very favorable due to opportunity I think. I think Bucky has the right of it.
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Nothing at all happens with locust until 10:00. Potato punches a hole through the north front and Blxssom piggibacks where the resistance is 1 grizzly and 1 razor. 5k value in locuts vs 2.2. East was around 4k metal army deficit before the dive and multiple fronts are suddently contested at the same time with overwhelming force on each. Steelblue vs doctorche, coolcat vs gounson, potato vs chonkgoose and potato's recluse thinning out chonk's amphs pretty much the entire match. It's an all around disaster for east at this point. I don't think the locust did anything because they were locust here. Blxssom just picked encounters that were very favorable due to opportunity I think. I think Bucky has the right of it.
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@B2498525
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@B2498525
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The first 4 minutes, the locust essentially spent time making a big blunder and then getting pickoffs at the center of the map to get back to 1.0 attrition kill. Blunder was flying over 3xgremlins+glaives, and then the regrouped locust killing back stray glaives.
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The first 4 minutes, the locust essentially spent time making a big blunder and then getting pickoffs at the center of the map to get back to 1.0 attrition kill. Blunder was flying over 3xgremlins+glaives, and then the regrouped locust killing back stray glaives.
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At 5:00 the locust dive on the southwest corner. blxssom loses one locust and kills around 1k in value. Out of position and lower in value daggers dive in after mexes and llt are lost. It's likely flying had a good part to play in the success of the raid, although pulling off the same thing with land raiders was not impossible. Case in point, north loses their southwest corner, but takes northeast at the same time with glaive and venom.
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At 5:00 the locust dive on the southwest corner. blxssom loses one locust and kills around 1k in value. Out of position and lower in value daggers dive in after mexes and llt are lost. It's likely flying had a good part to play in the success of the raid, although pulling off the same thing with land raiders was not impossible. Case in point, north loses their southwest corner, but takes northeast at the same time with glaive and venom.
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At 6:08 locust fly into north's base. 3.3k value in locust (+1 pyro) vs 1.3k in various defenses that include 4 gremlins and 3 glaives. The sheer value difference makes the locust victorious, but considering a pyro made it in with the ball, there was opportunity for land units to do the same. After this successful dive the locust escape through a basically empty midfield. Blxssom is at 1.31 attrition kill and 0.82 attrition damage.
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At 6:08 locust fly into north's base. 3.3k value in locust (+1 pyro) vs 1.3k in various defenses that include 4 gremlins and 3 glaives. The sheer value difference makes the locust victorious, but considering a pyro made it in with the ball, there was opportunity for land units to do the same. After this successful dive the locust escape through a basically empty midfield. Blxssom is at 1.31 attrition kill and 0.82 attrition damage.
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At 7:00, after having flown from mid to northeast, the locust pick off a few stray glaives from the northeast push. They got there probably faster than any other raider would, but also a player could have just split their ground forces a bit to do the same thing.
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At 7:00, after having flown from mid to northeast, the locust pick off a few stray glaives from the northeast push. They got there probably faster than any other raider would, but also a player could have just split their ground forces a bit to do the same thing.
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By 8:00, metal produced is basically equal. Army value and attrition difference is around 800. Worthy of note at this point however is that Blxssom is 1500 value killed ahead of the second highest. So far if there is one match to watch to see if the mobility of locust can deliver good resuts if used well, this would be the one. I still think land raiders could have done the same, but it's certainly easier to consistently find good opportunities if you can fly. The MO is very much still to hit where there is essentially no opposition at all.
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By 8:00, metal produced is basically equal. Army value and attrition difference is around 800. Worthy of note at this point however is that Blxssom is 1500 value killed ahead of the second highest. So far if there is one match to watch to see if the mobility of locust can deliver good resuts if used well, this would be the one. I still think land raiders could have done the same, but it's certainly easier to consistently find good opportunities if you can fly. The MO is very much still to hit where there is essentially no opposition at all.
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At 8:30, 3k of locust dives into 1.3k's worth of a mix of gremlin and glaives. They lose equal value, meaning that the locust swarm survives with 1.9k value. It's a killing blow because there is nothing left to check the locust and there are 2 pyros on top of the enemy factory cutting off all production.
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At 8:30, 3k of locust dives into 1.3k's worth of a mix of gremlin and glaives. They lose equal value, meaning that the locust swarm survives with 1.9k value. It's a killing blow because there is nothing left to check the locust and there are 2 pyros on top of the enemy factory cutting off all production.
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There are a couple of good chockes on desert rumble on which a snitch/imp could be planted and catch land raiders. Locust get to just fly in and out safely. The one thing I would say about locust in this match is that I think land raiders could have done the same, but locust are safe from the counters land raiders are subject to while AA of equal cost to those counters does not provide the same level of protection. I also still wonder if 2-3+ raptors would be enough to shut down locust. The caveat there being, as always, that specialized AA only counters air while locust are free to shoot at anything.
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There are a couple of good chockes on desert rumble on which a snitch/imp could be planted and catch land raiders. Locust get to just fly in and out safely. The one thing I would say about locust in this match is that I think land raiders could have done the same, but locust are safe from the counters land raiders are subject to while AA of equal cost to those counters does not provide the same level of protection. I also still wonder if 2-3+ raptors would be enough to shut down locust. The caveat there being, as always, that specialized AA only counters air while locust are free to shoot at anything.
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@B2498527
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@B2498527
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At 3:10 locust dive on a very exposed engicom already pressured by rovers.
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At 3:10 locust dive on a very exposed engicom already pressured by rovers.
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Nothing interesting happens. I'm not sure why this match is mentionned.
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Nothing interesting happens. I'm not sure why this match is mentionned.
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SUGGESTIONS: Gunship Balance