Loading...
  OR  Zero-K Name:    Password:   

Commander underwater gun morph

16 posts, 479 views
Post comment
Filter:    Player:  
sort
21 days ago
Why couldn't commanders get duck gun as a weapon for when someone goes into the sea, does the commander have to be defenseless in deep water?

I think I remember last time this topic was mentioned. That the reason why we don't have a morphable underwater weapon was to not noobtrap people who wanted to check out a torpedo weapon. But was it really the case?
+0 / -0

21 days ago
I would love this feature to be added
+0 / -0

21 days ago
bro desires tanky duck
+3 / -0

20 days ago
Yes this is good idea
+0 / -0
I´d like Torpedo Launcher as a com Morph

Something similar to Urchin
+0 / -0

20 days ago
Gauss or duck gun (for land and submarine) gun morphs would be nice.
+1 / -0
20 days ago
I think this could be a decent idea. Personally, some of the issues i identify with sea-k are:

  • No rotateability from land factories
  • Underwater unit interactivity is low
  • Commander being unable to riot
  • Weak turret selection

Combining these factors mean that early mistakes in a sea lane can easily result in a fac wipe. This level of decisiveness is atypical for team games. There are probably endless replay examples of sea lanes being lost in the first 5 (if not less) minutes.

Allowing commander to morph a usable weapon at sea might help, at least a bit. Now i've not given this a crazy amount of thought, so the only downside i can think of right now is making Siren rushes maybe a bit too easy.
+1 / -0
I think the main problem is that submerged units are not balanced around tanky units that can fight back.
Arguably the tankiest practical submerged unit is the Scallop and that only has 1200 health.
If you add a commander weapon that can fire submerged, you basically open up a whole can of worms.
You can now have a long range underwater sniper com with a huge HP pool. There is no comparable unit to that and sea combat would likely revolve around submerged long range sniper coms.
There used to be a long range sniper sub and it got removed because it was considered degenerate artillery gameplay.
Personally I didn't think it was that degenerate because I like arty duels unlike most players.

Now the longest practical submerged range is also the Scallop with 270 range, so even just a commander with 300 range could be considered a sniper/artillery if it could fire underwater.

Now you can argue that Ultimatum is more tanky than a Scallop, but it has less range and is easily overrun by raiders and the cloak is ignored by sonar.
Oh, and also the Detriment is more tanky and the gauss cannons have longer range than Scallop, but yeah...
Maps are rarely deep enough for Detriment to be fully submerged and it is in a whole other class anyway.
+5 / -0
20 days ago
Aren't commander upgrades really expensive and crippling eco-wise? If Ultimatum doesn't count, then Commander with 5 range upgrades on a duck-like missile that has little to no AoE isn't that bad. If anything, it could simply have a specific modifier to the weapon itself that prevents it from reaching over 270 range with upgrades. Claymores have 300 range and their projectile decimates anything underwater.
+0 / -0


20 days ago
Claymores are hovering surface units so they can always be hit back by anything above the surface, and they also have the same range as Scallop shotgun(285 for scallop shotgun vs 280 for Claymore).

Personally, I wouldn't mind if both sniper sub and torpedo weapon was brought back. I don't mind it.
I just think if you only bring back torpedo weapon, the sea combat is likely to revolve against long range torpedo commanders.
+0 / -0

19 days ago
Good comments there I think Ralle and Godde.

I think the underwater stuff probably is underdeveloped. It does feel a little janky too - I find it odd that the raven can't hit subs, yet we also don't have a torpedo bomber - I don't mind not having a torpedo bomber.

I agree that sea is usually more volatile than land - Pyro excepted - I've seen 1 pyro decide even team games.

I think a small ranged underwater ranged weapon on the commander would be sensible. More turrets might also be an option.

We were discussing the other day the Siren also doesn't really fit with Zero-K design philosophy - the secondary weapon shouldn't really exist and it hardly does anything except kill occasional mex.

Lances dominate the sea, though envoys can compete.
+0 / -0
Commanders did have a torpedo option long ago and it was bad for the reasons outlined by Godde as well as if you upgrade torpedo and pull your commander to land, it now has no weapon.

Can you disruptor in water? I'm thinking it works. I never tried. It's probably good enough for the intended purposes of what you're trying to acheive with com torpedo.

If anything, I think underwater needs less options not more.

Underwater is worse than cloak because at least the counterplay to cloak is to send fother in to screen. Submerged, the counterplay is woops I forgot to make/didn't make enough anti sub and now I just lose all my stuff. GG.

I'm trying to think of a mechanic that is more rock paper scissors than submerged and I can't think of anything.
+0 / -0
19 days ago
Couldn't the torpedo issue be addressed by having the gun also have the land version? In the same way how ducks and claymores have two guns taped together?

Also I am not sure if "underwater sniper commanders" would be that much of an issue. You can still lob yourself to them and kidnap them. Run them down with masses of raiders or raven bomb them. Personally I don't feel as if it'd be that much of a change aside from game start being less coinflipy.
+0 / -0
19 days ago
why we cant just let com have float upgrade or natively let him float
+1 / -0


16 days ago
Floating comm sounds ok. I think I'd want a visual for it as some comms look a bit topheavy.
+0 / -0
16 days ago
Swim ring upgrade
+1 / -0