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David vs Goliath: Rovers vs Tanks

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5 months ago
Gna use this thread to post my progress on doing david vs goliath.

So far, my plan is to use rover's superior speed to expand fast, then destroy the enemy's tank army with air units. Then dominate the player with tank switch.

Current progress:
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1949987 (fail)
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1949996 (out of my league)
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1950006 (good opener, no follow up)

Most recent lessons:
- One scorcher cannot beat a kodachi, I need two scorchers.
- Fencers are effective at fencing off kodachis
- 3 scorchers and 2 fencers can distract the opponent
- Keep scorchers and fencers at same movespeed by command
- A single dominatrix is enough to protect the base
- Learn a way to followup the opening

To anyone who will say that tanks are better to rovers, I will say the same desparate message I spammed in all caps in the lobby.
I STARTED THE MEME! I'M GOING TO PROVE THAT ROVERS CAN BEAT TANKS WITH SKILL! DO NOT DISCOURAGE ME!
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TheFlyingFortress
David vs Goliath,
pretty funny description, Goliath is the old name of Cyclops.

You can technically kill a kodachi with a scorcher with extreme micro, but this takes an somewhat long amount of time to accomplish, you would be missing out on other tasks in 1v1.
+1 / -0

5 months ago
Dart is the secret weapon early game against kodachi until you get rippers out; 1 dart + 1 scorcher used well kills one kodachi; the dart dies but the scorcher survives to be repaired. The two big problems are blitz, which universally kill rover if they can't get a solid economic advantage, and ogre, which force dominatrix from rover.
+2 / -0
Blitz vs ravager is favorable to rover, at scale. If the blitz can use it's full maneuverability then they can win. It's best to limit this with a few fencers or rippres, which will do well in a mix against blitz...

and blitz is just not good against so many other things

Ravagers have much better hp and dps for cost than tanks. Careful retreating of damaged units to prevent losses will allow them to overpower tanks. This means singling out one tank at a time to kill, and committing to it.

Since tanks still move at a decent pace, for retreat, it's often very useful to make a silo for slow/emp to force favorable engagements against them. I would guess that 10 slowed minotaur would lose badly to 1/4 their cost in ravagers.
+1 / -0

5 months ago
Didn't manage to duel anyone today... I'm going to post how it feels to play any factory but rovers:
+0 / -0
I understand now why I couldn't beat them tanks.
I was strong against tanks when it was small army vs big army.
But whenever I thought, "man, I don't have enough soldiers, I should expand my land," I fell into the "goliath" loophole.

So the only way I could beat this challenge is if instead of making more bases that make me bigger and removing my "small" status, if possible, more bases should have been made, controlled by small parties, all coordinated to defend against goliath. Each one of the "small" parties would have a 100 times power multiplier against the goliath, and goliath would ultimately lose.

Furthermore, although the raw power of the goliath would be stronger in a practical game, the upkeep would make the "goliath's" army too unsustainable, with the upkeep being soldier morale, exponentially increasing resource cost.

So long as these measurements aren't implemented, it's way harder to see how David would win. (It's probably why Goliath from the original tale thought that he's going to win: The alternatives weren't implemented yet) And Zero-K doesn't have these important details implemented; therefore, it is impossible to showcase a true David vs Goliath fight in Zero-K, and I give up.

Edit: Now that I think about it, a lot of cheeses and rushes sound like "david" fights. I don't think they count, since they don't let the "goliath" grow to full size; and even if the "goliath" would grow to full size, then it would be logical for "david" to be able to "borrow" some of the tech, meaning... perhaps it's closer to "hard" rather than impossible. But it's still nearly impossible due to the artificial requirements.
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