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Radical Airplane Plant Rework Proposal: Senshi Yukanna's Radical Idea

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6 hours ago

Airplane Plant Rework:


USranksenshiyukanna's Radical Idea
(This is just my opinion that may have some insights or inspirations for the current Magpie balance changes)

quote:
"A small comment is fine, especially if it focuses on how you feel rather than what you would change."
(Yea, I know. It's structured like a balance change rather than how I feel, but I tried to explain myself so they aren't just cold demands)

Summary: 2 unit replacements and other unit changes to allow Airplane Plant to be viable 1v1 factory on its own or at least a cheeky opening factory like the Gunship Plant


Complete the unit classes trio that ZeroK runs on, for planes:


  • (Bats and Eagles are reliably able to dive under shields to attack)
  • Swift, Fighter = Skirmisher/Anti-Air (Skirmisher/Anti-Air icon)
  • Bat, Interceptor = Riot/Anti-Air/Anti-sub (Riot/Star (bomb) icon)
  • Eagle, Strike = Support/Raider (Support icon)


Replace the Crane with the Stork, a Blastwing style constructor:


  • builds at 7.5 m/s
  • Stork is given the Magpie’s model and visuals
  • (Remove the Crane’s model as it is too confusing to recognize)
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Magpie
  • It has only a little more health than a Blastwing but is faster
  • 2 Storks, which are constructed in pairs, cost around a single Blastwing
  • Storks are manually killed by the D button or by a normal build command
  • If they die mid-air with a nanoframe or a finished structure then it is placed
  • When created by a factory, engineer commander, or itself it is made in pairs
  • Buildings more than a Mex (85) or Lotus (90) are only nanoframe insta-built
  • Stinger or factory nanoframes would be partially built by a single kamikaze
  • It would assist build the nanoframe rather than another instant kamikaze
  • The constructor charges up over time by expending metal and energy
  • Stork that is charged up but without a build command drops lotus
  • Once fully charged it can instantly build by that amount on death
  • Kamikaze constructor that can construct 2 duplicates per death
  • Stork must charge up metal and energy to build a pair of itself
  • Stork can at most inta-build 90 metal equal to a Lotus https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Lotus
  • It can repair, reclaim, or assist build as normal
  • Either increase build power or decrease cost
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Crane
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Wasp
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Blastwing
  • If a nanoframe build is invalid it spawns duplicates on death instead, up to 2 Storks, and Debris that hold the rest of the original stored metal value, such as trying to build:
    • Mexes where there is no metal deposit
    • Land-only structures where there is water
    • On a rough patch of terrain where the structure can’t place


Give the Owl the ability to rearm other planes while flying


  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Owl
  • This would incentivise building multiple Owls
  • Owls would rearm and heal planes that land on it
  • The rearming is instant but then Owl needs to rearm
  • This would make losing or having an Owl matter more
  • Owls basically are burst force multiplier for the ammo planes
  • Owls are now a living ammo bank that can move around quickly
  • Owls would be able to carry Hercules or Charon for quick airdrops


Add the Magpie weapon to the Swift and the Swift is considered a Fighter Skirmisher


  • (Also rename the Swift‘s description to: Skirmisher/Anti-Air Fighter)
  • Swift gets to keep the Magpie’s map icon
  • Skirmishing would the Swifts’ active niche
  • Light Skirmishing is kept in the plane factory
  • Swifts can be skirmishers and not just be scouts
  • The reload time and energy is kept for the missile
  • The Swift keeps all their original weapons additionally
  • The Mini Laser Blaster has slightly more range for the Swift:
  • Mini Laser Blaster Range: 777
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Swift
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Magpie


Replace the Magpie with the Eagle that has Plasma Cannons, EMG, and Shields that aren’t Tactical Strike Bombers but a dedicated plane ground Strike aircraft Raider


  • (Also rename the Eagle’s description to: Support/Raider Strike Aircraft)
  • The Eagle looks and functions like the Il-2 Shturmovik
  • The Eagle must fly completely straight to shoot so they are countered by assault, support, & skirmishers because they can lead their shots on the Eagle which the Eagle cannot dodge even if they don’t fire cannons or use rear guns because they have the around the same wide turn radius as the Bat but slower especially since the Eagle flies so low to the ground similar to a Locust
  • Eagle flies the slowest of all planes but is still faster than space shuttles
  • The Eagle acts as the plane’s Support/Raider with a support unit icon
  • Can have a support arrow icon for the Eagle plane when it has shields
  • Eagles fly straight into the target to get all 3 cannon shots then fly over
  • Different icons allow selection of the units as if they are different units
  • The Eagle is cheaper than the Raven with much less burst but more dps
  • The Eagle can have cylindrical shield that is as small as personal shield
  • Cannons and Shield need to be rearmed at an airpad but the EMG doesn’t
  • Quick units easily dodge the cannons similar to dodging assault cannons
  • Either has a flat diamond for strike aircraft or upside down anti air arrow
  • The shield is weak enough per energy that it can’t easily make a shieldball
  • Cannons are used to snipe riots, artillery, or anti air and EMG is for raiding
  • This completes airplanes as Swift / Skirmisher, Bat / Riot, & Eagle / Raider
  • The shield is meant to help it survive early game and tank anti air late game
  • The Eagle fills the role of a raider/support unit that can skirmish quite well
  • Visually the shield fades up and down with is brightest at the plane position
  • The Eagle is meant to aid the planes to fight spread out units but not clumps
  • Rear EMG guns attack ground units it flies over while cannons face forwards
  • The shield is cylindrical to shield high flying air and be hit both low and high
  • Cannons act like skirmishing, EMG like raiding, & Shield like support assault
  • Long rearm time between shields or cannons that are not on simultaneously
  • The shield somewhat protects it from both massed raiders and Anti Air fire
  • Press D to activate a non regenerating orange shield rather than cannons
  • Rear EMG guns lightly protect it from air that flies too close behind it
  • Anti Air EMG have the range and damage to kill Swifts but not Bats
  • It would fill the role of raider dueling and light raiding pressure
  • Flies close to the ground like the Locust so raiders can hit it
  • The orange shield blocks all damage until it is destroyed
  • The shield also does not link up with other shields
  • Swifts should agro hits for this plane then fly off
  • They have less health per cost than the Swift
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Locust
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Magpie
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Weapons
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Swift
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Raven


Bat replaces Raptor as riot anti-air and isn’t a fighter but an Interceptor Riot (Anti-Sub)


  • (Also rename the Bat’s description to: Riot/Anti-Air Interceptor (Anti-Sub))
  • Looks like the p38 lockheed lightning
  • Bats don’t have to fly straight like the Eagle and so they can dodge plasma cannons if there are only a few of them but they can’t dodge skirmisher fire because their turn radius is so wide that even if they turn to dodge a shot that is made with leading fire will still hit the bat since airplanes can't slow down and the Bat flies at around the same height as the Locust but with huge turns
  • Bats slow down to attack like Raptor https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Raptor
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Claymore Bat has the same icon as Claymore
  • Bat is a kamikaze riot anti-sub to be the airplane equivalent to the Claymore
  • This would be considered as the plane Heavy Riot with a more Riot icon
  • Bats can hit subs or submerged underwater units with the melee range
  • The Bat is faster than the Swift but it has a humongous turning radius
  • The attack has a moderate range and cooldown for melee with AOE
  • The Bat has a faster base speed than the Swift but has no boost
  • It has a high damage melee attack with life steal vampirism
  • The melee attack is best used as anti air but can hit ground
  • When hitting air it can just fly straight and deal damage
  • Hitting air has enough damage to lifesteal past anti air
  • When hitting ground it has to dive which takes time
  • When hitting ground it can easily die to anti air
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Swift
  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Raptor
  • https://zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/37319?page=2
  • https://test.zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/28080?page=1


Give the Odin a downwards terraform on their Thermite Bomb


  • https://zero-k.info/mediawiki/Odin
  • Odin’s Thermite Bomb would make a big thin crater on any land
  • The thin crater would prevent building in that area for a while
  • The crater terraforms buildings aswell like Quake missiles
  • The crater is deep but only the size of a 7x7 of solars
  • The crater would make Odin better against factories
  • Non-rough-terrain Factories get stuck in the craters
  • The thin crater would cost a lot of metal to restore
  • This would make it more unique and powerful
  • Jumpbots and Lobster can jump the craters
  • This gives it more use outside anti-static
  • Odins can disrupt the enemy front lines
  • Odins can make underwater ravines

Also, I know that this is a long winded and radical wishlist so take this as a set of creative ideas to fulfill some wants about the game and how I feel about the Airplane Plant in general, rather than a stone cold list of items I think need to be checked off.

(P.S. If you haven't noticed already I love this game and love this community.)
If you liked this idea and post format I have wayyy more ideas about many aspects of this game.
Please let me know what y'all think, and how it may help with the current air unit balance changes going on right now.

Thanks,
Senshi Yukanna
+1 / -0
6 hours ago
on a basic read, I like the owl idea (might need some balancing) and the odin change. Gotta digest the rest tho. But the crane change seems too op?
+0 / -0
11 minutes ago
Thanks CArankTarkin!
Yea, The Owl and Odin ideas felt like the cleanest and most right for fleshing out their existence in Zero-K as full units.
I really do appreciate anyone who takes the time to digest the rest. (and this too I hope)

The Crane change to Stork cost/speed/balancing values are probably op as they are now.
The main idea for that change was to make a Blitzkrieg style static defense airdrop kamikaze.
The whole point is to sacrifice eco (metal/energy/time/production invested in making Storks) for quick staying power.
This means that placing Mexes, Lotus, or any very cheap buildings quickly is possible in a constructor safe area.
It kind of leans into this Airplane burst attack ammo type warfare vibe that I get from the Airplane plant.
TLDR: Basically it is supposed to give a way to trade overall economy efficiency for burst spending.

That being said Eagle and Bat don't need ammo to deal damage (Eagle needing to rearm their shield and cannons but not their turret rear gunner and Bat using non-ammo lifesteal), but would make the Airplane plant more of a full standalone factory by completing the unit classes trio more traditionally with the Swift change in a way that seems fair and plane-y to me (turret gunners on a plane feels like a missed opportunity).

I hated how every other factory, even cheeky Gunship starters, felt so much more viable than planes
(I think planes are cool, but wait till you hear my ideas on adding trains, spaceships, and Voltron transformers!)
My thought process for finishing up the Airplane factory as a mainline non-support/secondary factory:
  • Question: Since planes are by identity very fast how do we make them fit into raider & riot roles rather than just long range weak bodied skirmishers?
  • Answer: Turn radius and attack range/position that forces certain approaches

Bat and Eagle have both have a huge turning radius making them "slower" & riskier at maneuvering over the map
Bat has to get into melee range to attack but doesn't need to rearm so it can be a proper damage riot
  • Question: If raiders are closer ranged than riots, how do we make them less ranged than melee?
  • Answer: The plane can has range behind itself so it has to enter enemy range and fly over then attack
That's why the Eagle has to fly completely straight to fire cannons (ammo like the Magpie, like bro I predicted it so I wanted to share what else I thought since I seemed to have aligned somehow) and has all of the non-ammo damage behind it

Also, I thought that a flexible strike aircraft would fit better historically/realistically since strike aircraft in real life were/are multipurpose tools with cannons and close air support defenses. These were of course applied either/or rather than at the same time. Therefore, I thought that, like the Odin, it should have a D-gun for protective measures, but centered around defending friendly air. I found the lack of decoy flares, infrared countermeasures, or any way to protect planes as a missed opportunity. The ammo non-regen shield (idk if they should link to each other or regen shields) is a very Zero-K sci-fi space-tech way to represent those defensive countermeasures in a way that seems fairer than a D-gun or automatic missile only prevention.

Sorry if this was another long winded read, but I wanted to make sure that my explanations/reasonings were thoroughly clear.
+0 / -0