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Commander storage upgrade

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Would it be possible to have an upgrade to the engineer commander that lets you have more storage, that would make it a bit more viable as a commander relative to the other ones because between fast building and not having lost almost all of your econ with your base the engineer commander would have the ability to quickly build at least a small base. In terms of game balance I do not believe that it would have any unbalanced effect in 1v1 games and would mostly serve to allow players in 3v3s and FFAs to get back on their feet faster after loosing their bases.

Thanks for reading and tell me what you think

Gil
+4 / -0
Skasi
Why not just build ? Storage modules would be a waste of upgrade slots.
+3 / -3
8 years ago
lets say you have a base with 7 storage buildings holding a total of 4000 metal and energy when your base gets blown up then you lose 3500 metal and energy unless you have 7 storage buildings somewhere else, with the storage on the commander you would not lose that metal and energy, also commanders can cloak meaning you could hide rescources from enemies instead of having your rescources in a vulnerable building. In normal matches it would not make any difference because there are more cost effective ways to store econ but it would be a fun option to have.

Gil
+0 / -0

8 years ago
NeonShadownstorm is real.

In team games it's up to your teammates to help you rebuild, while in FFA I suggest using underwater storages or just put a storage next to the power plant that allows your com to be cloaked.
+0 / -0
True but the point is options for the engineer commander and on commander storage would make the already awesome Carrepairers Nanolathe even more awesome
+0 / -0
8 years ago
quote:
lets say you have a base with 7 storage buildings holding a total of 4000 metal and energy when your base gets blown up then you lose 3500 metal and energy
Here are some suggestions what wampons to buy with 3500 coins http://zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/22330 so they do not get lost.

Commanders are already one-unit-armies. Well, at least sometimes players try to use them like that.
Buildpower-commanders quickly raising terraformhills with DDM on top is imo also quite ugly sight, such activities should require constructor-swarms. With storage-in-commander Coms could operate even more indepedent from base, I think not good. It is also another 'invisible' upgrade, unless commander gets a big as backpack...
+1 / -0
8 years ago
maybe have the storage be in exchange for reduced speed or something
+0 / -0
FAQ:

Q: I want to have more storage space.
A: You don't need storage space. Spend metal immediately. Stored metal sacrifices tempo for versatility. You need to know the intricacies of most unit interactions to use that versatility and even then you still need specific situation to use that. As a rule of thumb, don't store metal.

Q: I understand but still want storage (because I'm a pro or don't care about optimal play).
A: Make the storage building.

Q: But I want to have storage on Commander.
A: Use your Commander to build the storage building.

Q: But what if my base dies?
A: Protect your base better.

Q: I couldn't, I got 2v1 and couldn't get help!
A: Hide your storage.

Q: I tried the above and still lost my storage.
A: Make a new one.

Q: But that way I still lose my stored metal!
A: Not if you make the new one before the old one dies.

Q: I can't always predict my old storage dying.
A: Only in extreme cases. For the extreme cases the enemy has to be super sneaky and for that he deserves to remove your stored metal.

Q: I still think it's good to have an insurance against losing my stored metal.
A: It is extremely suboptimal. If you accept that, make redundant storages.

Q: But good player XYZ makes tons of storages!
A: Yes, but they actually do have that much metal, it is not stored metal loss insurance.
+7 / -1
8 years ago
sorry, was just broaching the idea because I believed it might be fun to have ingame because of fun not so it would mess with your "perfect" way to play the game. Many people that I know in 0k play it because it is a fun and interesting game and not because they need to use the most absolutely eficcient strategies so they can keep a perfect Win/Loss ratio. 0k is a fun community driven rts, not DOTA
+0 / -0
8 years ago
Also I was talking about the ENGINEER commander not the others, and integrated storage for the engineer would fit with the style of play that it has
+2 / -0
Skasi
I think ZK also needs a storage strider. Bring back Jugglenaut and redesign it into Storagenaut! Also storage missile and storagefactory. Btw, why can't Dirtbag be used as a Metalbag? Bags are supposed to store different things!

USrankGilgamos if you want mobile storages, spam builders. They are mobile and can be reclaimed for metal.

Adding new units and other things just for the sake of it would result in a really messy, chaotic game with an overcrowded interface. One of the first things CA/ZK did after its birth was removing dozens of units, buildings, tech levels and even getting rid of the concept of factions.

I'm not saying your idea is bad, that it shouldn't be considered or that it'll never happen, but keep in mind that not every single idea anybody ever comes up with needs to be implemented to make a game "fun".
+5 / -0
I hate to be callous, but having your metal go when your storages die is kinda the point. Your opponent was able to get in to destroy them, so they earned that. If you destroyed your opponent(s)' storages, wouldn't you want that to be worth your effort?

As PLrankAdminSprung mentioned, storages are a tradeoff, though another part of that tradeoff is that you risk that versatility getting targeted.

As a rule, Zero-K is designed such that as much of it as possible is interactive and carries some risk of destruction, since basically everything is on the map, rather than having upgrades or off-map abilities that your opponent can't touch. The flip side is that you can use that against your opponent, to deny their economy/stored resources/production capacity as well.
+3 / -0

8 years ago
Gilgamos he was just having fun.

While it may not be fun to have your storages destroyed, and it hurts your experience personally, the work required (someone has to code it), the global balance (coms with 52 BP and a crapton of storage slamming stingers all up in your base while in turn, have only a few wind gens on a hill somewhere for you to scout), play dynamic (encourages non-interaction) and social implications (now we can have people trolling twice as hard by both trollcomming and massing storage simultaneously) make it not worth implementing.

While discussion of these topics is fun, this community produces a veritable onslaught of suggestions, and very few get implemented. It's not worth getting salty over one not working out *cries a silent tear for the scorpion broodmother platform*.

The experience you've had may be an uninspiring way to lose, but, if you play more, and get better, it will very rarely happen. While perhaps a little facetious, Sprung's points were spot on. Rather than addressing the issue by attempting to enact change in the game balance, adapting to the reality of how storage is implemented in this game will serve you better.
+4 / -0

8 years ago
glhf and let every unit has a storage upgrade
+0 / -0


8 years ago
The main issue I see with a storage module is that it would be useful very rarely. It is a question of design as to whether we want options which would be that rare.
+2 / -0
8 years ago
Also: morphing = storage, if you cancel :)
+4 / -0
8 years ago
True, good point GoogleFrog :)
+0 / -0

8 years ago
Storages are only usab;e in two ways. You have heavy buildpower to build quickly some unit/weapon to surprise enemy (i have seen this rarely) or you just need store metal after large reclaiming very fast. Storage cost 100 and can take 500. So it means 20% pay from stored resources for each storage. Of course you can reclaim storege after its use. This mean thay you will get more metal back.
+0 / -0

8 years ago
I think it's interesting that there is a such a strong community bias towards building storage. Perhaps because new players tend to do it excessively?

I confess that I will commit the faux paw and build storage when I have a lot of wind, aspis, skuttles, erasers, etc. Metal isn't the only resource in z-k.

I'm not sure if this applies to z-k but in BA, when the income rate exceeds total storage capacity, construction gets "jerky" and slows down. Is this also the case for z-k on a speedmetal map
+0 / -0
8 years ago
Maybe a 25-50 pt. increase in storage per morph would be in order. I'm also on the side of - don't store it - spend it. If you've got enough E/M to need storage, get crankin' :-)
+0 / -0
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