Loading...
  OR  Zero-K Name:    Password:   

How to nerf Godde?

88 posts, 2070 views
Post comment
Filter:    Player:  
Page of 5 (88 records)
sort
Today I tried to stream some 1v1s again, but that only destroyed my mood. Streaming noticeably detracts from my attention (I'm always better at tournaments) which was combined with 3/7 played games where I had a win chance of less than 10%. (The other games were around 50% win chance)

It's completely understandable that players want to hop in when they see me play, but could you think of a way that we could improve the situation such that one isn't stuck in Godde's toy position for the evening when they're the only guy in his elo range? Outside of streaming I'd just wait a bit for someone else to get matched, but that's no solution when one wants to play continuously.

In my case you could probably just tell me to git gud so I can have a fighting chance against top 10 again, but what about other players?

One thing I could imagine would be for the Matchmaker to look at e.g. the last five games of a player and then try to give the player matches that even out the win chances. The downside would be that if you're the strongest player online (or the strongest player overall) you'd have a harder time finding matches if there aren't multiple people to take turns in getting bashed. What would you think about this?
+5 / -0
Getting matched against the same player who you know will kick your ass over and over again is annoying I guess. It might be simpler to just alter the match-maker behavior a little if you would be matched against someone you played against recently. Such as expanding the elo range, giving preference to other players and waiting longer.

Then again, there are rarely more than a few people in matchmaker, so its not like there are lots of options.
+1 / -0
i allmost allways get matched against Godde or randy,i kinda want to play other ppl too,but i understand that its kinda annoying to allways get matched against some with 200-400 elo more than you just to get rekt...On the other hand it gets kinda boring to just play the same ppl all the time.

The problem i think aint the matchmaker thats solvable easily its just that not many ppl play 1v1's actively so you just end up waiting for a game for soo long...thats why its the way it is now with like 200-400 acceptance.
+2 / -0
8 months ago
Are we assuming there will be more than two people in the matchmaking queue?
+5 / -0
8 months ago
How to nerf Godde?


Do you know where he lives?
LOL
+4 / -0
8 months ago
people in party can com 1v1

[Spoiler]
+1 / -0

8 months ago
Why don't you ask SErankGodde?

https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/953451

quote:
I'm starting to think Rogue is OP.
This gameplay is pretty boring.
Just spam rogue, lotus turrets and bandits. It is all Sigero and rANDY does nowadays.


quote:
It feels like everything is getting buffed besides raiders.
+2 / -0

8 months ago
Dein just make a room and invite people to play against you!
+1 / -0


8 months ago
I thought godde's toy was my schtick today, were you stealing the spotlight
+2 / -0
8 months ago
I suggest Godde Patreon where as lobs donate for every game lost!
+1 / -0
Perhaps we can make matchmaker do the following if two players of significantly different elo are the only players in queue:

*subsequent re matches after the 1st one won't be counted for elo
*the lower elo player will spawn with various random advantages (extra metal, extra comm, extra fac, etc)
+0 / -0


8 months ago
I've pondered the concept of a game and matchmaking system where the goal of the matchmaker is to feed handicap data into the game such that the win chance of arbitrary matches is 50%. Players would still have a rating, with the 'prestige' of the top rank being that you take a handicap against everyone. It's mathematically possible for a rating system to learn the handicaps required for a toy example, the question is whether a handicap that works and doesn't feel terrible to play with could be devised.

Here is a simple handicap that achieves the basic idea (minus the handicap feeling good) provided the theory behind WHR works. If the lower skill player loses a 1v1 then, with some probability, report that the lower skill player actually won instead. Vary the probability based on the skill gap to make each player actually win 50% of the time. Of course, this handicap is simple and feels terrible.

Making the handicap feel good may well be beyond the scope of ZK. It may even be beyond the scope of traditional RTS. The game would need to be designed with some sort of natural handicap system in mind, and would probably need to have fewer positive feedback loops than are common to RTS. Handicaps that mess with unit stats are dangerous because they throw off your ability to learn unit interactions. Handicaps that mess with economy throw off your ability to feel how much an opponent should have. Maybe it requires some sort of fairly-linear victory point control system, and one player could simply start with more points.
+1 / -0

8 months ago
Another possibility is to record / present some secondary statistic/s.

For example, you could estimate attrition ratio or time to win vs a particular player. Then you could present a number that indicated whether you had performed above or below average in the head to head, even if you "lost".

I appreciate those numbers would be fairly easy to game without some additional constraints.
+1 / -0


8 months ago
I plan to make a super advanced World War II strategy game where you dynamically change the victory conditions depending on the skill disparity between the players.

I will start development any decade now...
+2 / -0
CHrankAdminDeinFreund I have a bit of experience with this sensation you're describing from my first time around climbing up the ladder. Randy, Drone, Manu, Kingstad, Sigero etc - the majority of these players were not active in 1v1 during my rise. But I can tell you who was active. Goddo. And I would be matched against him endlessly.

Rewind a little. Prior to Godde being my nemesis, and ultimately target, I had 2-3 other rivals that I always got matched with and simply could not beat. The hardest of them being CHrankDrDoom. This is important step #1: If I ever wanted to beat him, I knew I had to queue up and practise / get beaten up no matter what. Every loss was a lesson. Eventually, I beat him and the real Sparkles congratulated me for this personal goal because the work I put in was apparent.

Fastforward back to Godde. I'm in the no2 spot on the ladder at this point, and it's before your system changes. Wins and losses are all like 1-3 elo - and Godde is currently 300 elo or so above me. At this point, the only thing I could think was that I would have to become so good that even the no1 player was irrelevant to my PERSONAL sense of improvement. I had to put him out of my mind, and concentrate on me. That's important step #2. Mastering all of your own weaknesses and focusing on your strengths. Mine was rovers.

I learned through endlessly being matched with him that there's a psychology to RTS games which Godde is aware of and exploits, show by (even recent) comments like "instilling fear" as a means to prevent raiding, allow greed etc. Important lesson #3: Don't be afraid. Godde is a good player, but is no more special in reality than anyone else - he's special in your head. Change him from a predator to Big Game Prey in your mind and you'll be empowered mentally to actually make defeating him into a reality. Go on the hunt.

Important lesson #4 was when I realized that a lot of his success came from extreme familiarity with 1v1, the maps, his opponents, the replays, and the current balance. He wavers when balance changes, just like anyone else. But he's done the map pool to death and has very refined, very rehearsed routines memorized that you're working against. The lesson is similar to stuff I said above, but you really need to learn your own rehearsed approaches to optimize your game on each map. Any tournament I've been in, one of which you won with me, I've spent hours rehearsing the maps beforehand and taking notes. You've even done that with me. Apply it here too.

The takeway from this is that if you REALLY care about the journey of overcoming Godde, you need to earn your ability to say that you've overcome him be surmounting all the work he's put in - by putting in your own work. You're a ridiculously good player, particularly in FFA where it's slower pace, but I've watched you on stream and how you play 1v1. You don't have the instinct of a predator turned on. Get beaten 20 times and learn the maps and 1v1 mentality / meta. Then once you know exactly what's up, turn that fucking instinct ON.

This advice also goes to anyone else who doesn't queue "because Godde". You're making it worse for eachother by denying yourselves the chance to be matchmade with eachother during his online time.
+9 / -0


8 months ago
And a quicker alternative that is probably more relevant to what you were actually saying... Add a UI element in the lobby when you right click a player's name "Challenge to Duel" - instant ranked 1v1 invitation to any player you like. That way, you can get that game with a person you're comfortable with.
+4 / -0
I remember the days when I was streaming the high ELO battles and people were watching the stream for spec cheat and not for curiosity or interest :D

This is why I don't do lives on Zero-K. I need to add a delay of at least 1 minutes but even so in team games this really brakes the stuff since people can see where you place singus/nukes and other structures on the map.
+0 / -0


8 months ago
imo can just handicap in the form of lower intrinsic income. Even tiny difference like -0.2/-0.2 adds up through a game.

imo intrinsic income should be variable anyway (eg higher playercount = lower intrinsic income per player)
+0 / -0
8 months ago
Handicaps reduce morale, buffs increase it. Buff the weaker player instead of handicapping the stronger one.
+0 / -0

8 months ago
I think it would be easier to remove the current matchmaking, that is to remove the possibility of the machine to choose the opponent, but if for example, I want to play in 1v1 mode, I will be presented with a list of probable opponents present online in that Moment. If I like playing against the first player I choose his name, and if he agrees, the game starts.
Even now I have seen that there are games between players of different ranks, completely unbalanced. I don't understand why the player can't choose his opponent, but the machine.
+2 / -0
Page of 5 (88 records)