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Free-Fire Mode in FPS View

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8 years ago
I've been playing around with FPS View and found a few problems that I can't figure out. First, I can't seem to force fire on my own units...is there an override? Second, when I hold the right mouse button the message "free-fire mode" comes up and the targeting computer seems disabled but I cannot left click to fire while holding this. The minute I let the right button go the message disappears and the targeting computer is back in charge. How do I perform a "free-fire"?
+0 / -0
Zero-K does not support FPS view. Frankly it should be disabled as it is EvoRTS to remove the confusion regarding its buggy nature.
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Firing on own units has the same rules as outside FPS (ie. some weapons can do that, eg. Newton). There is no override because FPS mode is a useless engine gimmick and people would use it to troll.

Free fire means targeting is non-FPS (ie. enemies get automatically shot and nothing else happens).

You cannot shoot in the air because that would allow range hax.

Future users will not have the FPS mode bound to any hotkey. This is soft removal more or less.
+1 / -0


8 years ago
Back in XTA days people used to use FPS to use rocko missiles as artillery vs LLTs lol
+4 / -0
8 years ago
FPS mode could be used for cinematics in campaign maybe?
+0 / -0

8 years ago
"Range hax" is one of those things where I wonder why the philosophy of "if the unit could do that, let it try" doesn't apply. Obviously it would be broken for a few units, but missing a radar dot tends to have the exact effect.

So, in my eyes, a consequential approach would be to remove overshooting. But that's just my uneducated opinion with no clue how hard it would be to implement it.
+0 / -0


8 years ago
You would have to make every ballistic projectile fire at 45 degrees. Every missile would have to explode at max range.
+2 / -0
So wind affects only solar wind stations?

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8 years ago
Yes, wind does not affect weapon projectiles.
It only affects wind generators, and some visual particles (eg. smoke from geo vents).
+1 / -0
No Huj, wind does not affect solar stations.







Sorry...
+1 / -0
Wind affected projectiles in OTA.
+1 / -0
quote:
Firing on own units has the same rules as outside FPS (ie. some weapons can do that, eg. Newton). There is no override because FPS mode is a useless engine gimmick and people would use it to troll.

Free fire means targeting is non-FPS (ie. enemies get automatically shot and nothing else happens).

You cannot shoot in the air because that would allow range hax.

Future users will not have the FPS mode bound to any hotkey. This is soft removal more or less.


Nooooooo! Please tell me it isn't so! The FPS mode and terraforming shown in the YouTube features trailer (you know, "take in the big picture"..."or get close and personal", were the big clinchers for me to download and try this game. In my head I was imagining a TA-style pre-planned assault beginning which I could then take control of the lead unit to lead the charge movie-style! How friggin awesome is that!!!

So right now FPS is just a cool feature while I use single-player mode to check out all the units and it makes getting my bearings and screwing around way more intuitive and FUUUUUN!! (because if you haven't taken the helm of the Tremor, which IMHO is just awesome, and sprayed an island for kicks then you're simply missing out on life LOL) This is a GAME isn't it? Fun needs to count for something.

Speaking of which does anyone know a way to override the "don't shoot my units" thing? Even Sim City came with Godzilla, earthquakes, and tornadoes and I'm sure those weren't intended to build infrastructure ;-)

So what I see is that FPS seems to have been written off and gets a lot of hate-on in the forums yet it's one of the most distinguishing features between Zero-K and the plethora of bland, robotic RTS slurry out there.

Finally I know this is getting kind of lengthy but AUrankAdminGoogleFrog, regarding the range advantage in FPS, I feel that SOME better aim/distance is reasonable exchange for the player's dedicated full attention. It may be my unfamiliarity with the game but I don't understand using FPS for trolling thing or why it would be disqualified as a legitimate part of strategy to harrass enemy units. It has the potential to considerably add to gameplay depth and realism (spurts of micromanagement are actually how things work in real-life upper management, and by extension military command, where you set the parameters/script/policies for how things should run but since it's real life and not a simulation you have to get down into the trenches from time-to-time because of what they say about the best laid plans of mice and men).

Anyways these are just the excited thoughts of an RTS veteran but a newb to Zero-K. Let me know what you guys think.
+2 / -0
quote:
The FPS mode and terraforming shown in the YouTube features traile

Fair enough. That is a good argument to remove the trailer that promotes non existent features.
The FPS mode was created by engine devs a long time ago as a gimmick. There is absolutely no incentive to make it viable in ZK.

quote:
So right now FPS is just a cool feature while I use single-player mode to check out all the units and it makes getting my bearings and screwing around way more intuitive and FUUUUUN!!

If you prefer the FPS mode your probably didn't want to play an RTS in the first place (at least not at the current time of screwing around).

quote:
So what I see is that FPS seems to have been written off and gets a lot of hate-on in the forums yet it's one of the most distinguishing features between Zero-K and the plethora of bland, robotic RTS slurry out there.


As a vivid RTS player myself I say that ZK is very distinguishable on in otherselves and doesn't need to have a feature that doesn't serve any purpose besides being good to screw around with. More to the point you while saying that FPS mode is so FUN and unique at the same time are pointing out one of the very numerous issues an bugs within that engine feature. Lemme point them for you:
Controlled unit ignoring movement (sometimes).
Controlled unit cannot target something (sometimes).
Some units do not work because of scripted nature of weapons.
Breaks balance.

tl;dr Zero-K != Urban Assault

quote:
FPS mode could be used for cinematics in campaign maybe?

Campaign already has a camera script installed within it, that can give the same camera angles as FPS mode.
+1 / -0
Edit: ffs orf stop sniping me >_>
quote:
does anyone know a way to override the "don't shoot my units" thing?

There is none. Some weapons like Pyro flamethrower can do that by default though (which they also do outside FPS).

quote:
it's one of the most distinguishing features between Zero-K and the plethora of bland, robotic RTS slurry out there

Do you think so? That means whoever made the trailer screwed up massively and failed to put enough emphasis on the actual distinguishing features (RTS with physics, automation, flat tech tree...) and put random gimmicks as the highlights instead.

quote:
has the potential to considerably add to gameplay depth and realism

Depth comes from choices, not implementing them. Anything I choose the unit to do, I can make it do through normal commands so FPS adds no depth. If it allowed some additional stuff (like outrange) then one would be forced to "manually" implement that choice which is against the ZK philosophy.

About realism: yeah, so very realistic for a general to go and borrow some frontline soldier's gun and run around. Anyway, ZK values gameplay over realism so unless it helps intuition at no gameplay cost these arguments are usually disregarded.
+2 / -0
PLrankAdminSprung, I concede that last point about realism. Not realistic.

...and it DOES violate ZK (or should I say TA) philosophy. But so does setting bounties on individual units and I don't see anyone bashing that! In fact, can you think of anything more SATISFYING, than killing a bounty unit hands-on in FPS view?!? "Up close and personal" INDEED!

Having the ability to plan as high-level or micromanage as low-level as you choose represents a dimension of game depth to me. Not the only dimension, but certainly one of them.

As for the trailer it was sheer eye candy and conveyed most of the great features of ZK. The terraforming and FPS stuck out for ME personally (and maybe others) because I've never seen those in an RTS before. Other features may have struck a chord with other people. Don't flat tech trees mean there's no battle escalation? Between that and the over-automation won't the matches lack memorable milestones...ups and downs...a climax? Excitement? Won't it be like that movie where Tom Hanks is stranded on an island and it just drags on and on and then suddenly ends? LOL OK...now that bordered on trolling, obviously I'll have to finish familiarizing myself and get a few battles under my belt so I can make some informed commentary rather than curious projections about things like match highlights and meaningful (i.e. winning) options, choices, and strategies open to a player during a match :-)
+0 / -0

8 years ago
...What is a "bounty unit"?

As for the "battle escalation" point, each factory has heavier units which are only practical to build later in the game and the Strider Hub builds super-heavy units (effectively a higher-tier factory).
+0 / -0
PLrankOrfelius, I didn't mean to imply that ZK is not distinguishable. All I was saying is that an FPS mode is some crazy awesomesauce that nobody else has got. Seriously I can't name a single other RTS with that feature. You're right that if I "prefer" FPS mode that I'm not looking to play an RTS, but it's not like I want to play a whole match through the viewfinder of a single unit or something. I just feel it makes a good, unique addition to the full scope of control and choices available in the game (top-level planning <-----> micromanagement). If someone finds it fun or useful I fail to see how it negatively impacts someone who doesn't, so why talk as if it's something that needs to be hidden away or removed like unwanted body hair?

Also regarding wanting to play an RTS...well I'll play whatever as long as it's engaging and fun. I'm not too concerned whether it is Certified by the International Committee on Stringent Genre Definitions™. In fact removing features just to comply with a definition might result in missing out on something new and great while becoming a clone of everything else ahem evoRTS. Imagine Sam Raimi had said "This funny business needs to be removed from Army of Darkness! This isn't a comedy, we're trying to produce a serious horror B-movie here!!".

Anyways, I'm no fan of FPS games, in fact I had to Google this Urban Strike thing you mentioned but the way that comment was phrased has given me insight into why the FPS features might be getting bashed so harshly: people are afraid that if it's kept and/or expanded then by 2024 when ZK V6.8.8.12 is released it'll be 100% FPS, like Command & Conquer: Renegade or something. Ha ha ha - no need to worry. The only way to have that happen would be to hand it over to EA then whatever the worst possible fate for the game is would be inevitable! Like that horrendous Wing Commander movie which no amount of alcohol has been able to purge from my memories...
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quote:
...What is a "bounty unit"?


Sorry I read it in this thread (http://zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/2070) but on second review this might not have actually been implemented.

...and yeah I just started playing around with this Strider Factory. I built a Catapult. Sorry Tremor...I've found a new love!

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Ummm...@Sprung...@Orfelius, humility isn't my forte but can I humbly ask how you guys put those em tags into your replies like that? It tells me I'm doing dangerous things when I try.
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CArankPOLAX refer to the forum formatting thread http://zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/2424 :)
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