Loading...
  OR  Zero-K Name:    Password:   

Replays of revenant being OP

40 posts, 1452 views
Post comment
Filter:    Player:  
Page of 2 (40 records)
sort

2 months ago
I'm not looking for discussion cluttering the thread, this is just to post replays to help support that revenant should be nerfed a bit.


+6 / -0

2 months ago
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1890954
+1 / -0


2 months ago
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1890922
+1 / -0

2 months ago
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1892536
+1 / -0

2 months ago
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1893867
+0 / -0


2 months ago
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1894772
+0 / -0
30 days ago
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1938484
+0 / -0
27 days ago
https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1940721

how are tanks supposed to counter rev rush?
sry, but its hp pool is ridiculus.
+1 / -0
27 days ago
This thread is kind of biased. Doesnt anyone have replays of revenants being UP?
+0 / -0
quote:
This thread is kind of biased.

quote:

I'm not looking for discussion cluttering the thread, this is just to post replays to help support that revenant should be nerfed a bit.

quote:
Doesnt anyone have replays of revenants being UP?

quote:
this is just to post replays to help support that revenant should be nerfed a bit.
+2 / -0
quote:
56 days ago

maybe means that those quotes dont add up to a useful way to convince devs of anything, at least on their own

But to actually answer the question, I did make this thread, which I guess I should go bump: https://zero-k.info/Forum/Thread/37585
+1 / -0
27 days ago
no, i mean, this isn't how science works

You can't just do an experiment and then only pick the data which supports your hypothesis, you must also engage with the data that doesn't support your hypothesis
+0 / -0

27 days ago
If you look at the post history of people complaining about specific units being too strong, the usual response is either an experienced player pointing out a few mistakes and the correct response, or GoogleFrog typing up "I took control at this point and did this and this and this"...

Nobody just takes replays at face value.
+1 / -0
27 days ago
i agree with the point that those replays are not an exact study.

but this unit is still totaly overpowered
And everybody that plays Zerok will have noticed it by now.

https://zero-k.info/Battles/Detail/1940806
Another replay where 1 air player and the combined efforts of multiple players to provide additional aa, were not enough
+0 / -0
27 days ago
ok here a propper argumentation:


With the exception of 1v1 and possibly 2v2 games, the following statement is true:

If someone builds a Revenant at the start of the game, which is not expensive at 850 Metal, then he has a highly mobile and very durable unit. This machine is also equipped with high burst DMG and a comparatively ridiculously low reload of 9s for 220*9 dmg.

The opposing team now faces the following challenge.
Somewhere on the map, a unit will now appear that can wipe out all units except heavy tanks with a single blow.
All coms at the front are now in danger. Its usually 2/3 shots to kill it. Depending on com-choice, upgrades, received dmg aso.
All optimists will be disappointed within the next minute. At this point, no single player has enough anti-air to stop a Revenant.
This means the Revenant will probably do 300/400 metal killed damage, up to a com-kill, and survive.

Now some will say, ok but that's a rush. Once AA is on the field, the situation changes.
No, it won't. Because while this AA is being built, more Revenants are also being built.


Short detour:
Let's look at AA.

I've seen cows that are more afraid of a fly than Revenants are of Swifts.
Raptor? Using this unit against Gs basically doesn't work and Revenant doesn't even need support.
Trident is a great aa unit. Btw you need 7 of them to take a Revenant down, because your reload is 10 seconds, you only shoot once.
Gremlins: you need 7 of them to take a Rev down, if the shooting duration of them all is 10 seconds. That costs you 910 metal
Vandal: As already written somewhere else, if you build this unit, you loost control over your life. By far the worst aa unit in the game. Kills nothing and dies to everything.
Crasher, a glimmer of hope. If they get 3 shots of, you need only 5 of them. Great :D, just pay the 1100 metal pls.
Flail, ok aa, lets assume you manage to get 2 shots of. You need 6 of them. 1200 Metal
Tarantula? Ok, lets say 4 shots. Hey, even 5. (Thats 10 sec fighting) You only need 4 of them, yey. Only sad they cost 1520 metal.
Toad, the best aa in this game. Lets assume 9 sec of fighting time. yey, you need only 3 at a meager price of 1500metal.
Ettin, another great one. Again 9 seconds for the fighting, and the result is 3. 1500 Metal pls.
Zephyr, Actually, I only ever see this unit miss, but ok. You need 5 of those beauties with a pricetag of 2000metal.

And that is it. Those are your absolut abysmal dedicated options.
(I am of course aware that this analysis does not correspond to reality. There are also other units shooting at Revs, of course.) But with 2 Revs, who says all aa will focus on one???


The game goes a little further. There are now 3 or 4 Revs travelling the pitch together.
These can now attack even larger unit combinations. Shieldballs, tank armies, grizzlies, penetrators behind friendly lines, nothing is save anymore. The entire team now has exactly one choice. Die or everyone builds enough AA to fend off the Revs on their part of the front without air support. This means that every single player on the team has to invest more metal than the rev spammer in AA and at the same time hold his front line. I love this plan, a masterpiece of tactical prowess.

To briefly address the raiders' argument. Sure, raiders defeat revs. But Raiders get beat up by everything else on the field.... That's not a winning concept.

And now someone can try again to claim that there is not a fundamental problem with this unit.
+11 / -0


27 days ago
Great comment Anir. I would add that in a 4 v 4, making even only 1 revenant and then plating is almost totally dominant over not making one, as the amount of AA that eventually has to be made all over the map to counter this single unit can be game winning.
+2 / -0
What if the receiving defending team just spams raiders?

The one thing revs can do that raiders can't really counter is exploiting sharp pitches.

TBH I'd be glad to see revs nerfed, but I don't really have a justification.
+0 / -0
27 days ago
It would be funny if Hercules could steal Revs
+0 / -0
27 days ago
LUrankAdminAnir's assumptions are somewhat pessimistic. 9-10s engagement times correspond to AA units that are initially behind the Revenant's target, a Revenant that is willing to die to get a second salvo off, and a target or targets too important to let the Revenant get off a second salvo even with the benefit of reclaiming both the target and the Revenant. This is unusual. If the Revenant leaves for repair after each salvo, or must be prevented from attacking entirely, then engagements will typically be shorter. If the Revenant must escape after the second salvo, or the AA is positioned about 200 elmo in front of the target, it will die to a lesser cost in almost all AA. Anir also ignored Anglers and static AA as option.

The fast end of mobile AA - Crasher, Trident, Flail, Gremlin and Vandal, I'm not counting planes - can try to follow a retreating Revenant to extend the engagement and get the kill. This tips the cost comparison into their favor, at least assuming the AA group can show up where the Revenant attacks.

Meanwhile, static AA gets the job done quicker per-cost if it doesn't just make the Revenant take chip damage and then go elsewhere.

I also think Anir is unduly dismissive of Vandals. If the goal is to kill a Revenant as quickly as possible without spending a single unit of metal over a Revenant's 850 cost, 9 Vandals does about as well as anything else, and they don't have the next problem.

It's a problem for the defenders that the heavy end of mobile AA are themselves a good target for Revenant strikes. A Revenant that takes e.g. a Flail hit before striking can just fly over, kill the Flail, and get away unless the AA group has sufficient sustained damage with the Flail removed.

As another issue, the best mobile answer to an early Revenant is itself a gunship, so obvious evolution of the meta is for both sides to rush a Revenant and then rush a Revanent-hunting squad before building more Revenants or plating out of the strat.
+0 / -0
27 days ago
quote:
Buckymancer

Can you provide your own replays supporting these theories
+1 / -0
Page of 2 (40 records)