ive allways thought this is needed, a record of what units are usless/without a proper role/broken at the current moment, ill try to keep this up to date: the key offenders: hammers (allways at the top) djin (needs mass teleportation ability (for proper sneak attak) or be buildable by regular con/com (in structure form like sneaky pete) krow (a flying white elephant) rapier (competeng with banshees) hover antisub unit (or lack there of) the not so shit but still usless list: moderator (give it jump ability) juggelnaut (f***ing awsome, but needs cost reduction to ~6-7k) the broken due to engine bugs list: all bombers (especialy the carpet bombers) Htanks, light veh, ~sea, hover (pathing engine problems)
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I disagree. All of theese units have a role and have a use. Is the usage window to small? Can be discussed. But not on theese units: Flail:One of the best mobile AA units in my opinion. Fast. Heavy weight. Can dodge shadows well. High alpha. It does not get blocked by cliffs or friendly units because it has vertical missile launch. Hovers already got strong makeshift AA like Mace and Scalpel(Scrubbers also hit airunits well if they get close) so it's not like Flail needs to be good against Gnats. Goliath:Use it to spearhead your Reaper force and slowdown the enemy reapers so they can't escape. Goliath can beat both Sumo and Bantha on flat terrain with some micro. As numbers get higher Golies outperform Reapers in most situations. Moderator:It is the only reason that Jacks and Pyros can fight against Zeus and Warriors in a 1v1. Microheavy? Yes it is. Does it need to be buffed? Propably not. I'd like to add Rapiers as the role of the Rapier is competing too much with the Banshee as the Banshee is so much better in most circumstances. Rapiers are only better when you got a big ball of them and the enemy airplayer have too few VAMPs to counter them.
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Jack is useful. It functions as good antiporc when you don't have enough for a firewalker or there are a lot of shields, and also kills most commanders.
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-Hermits seem too weak now, they are supposed to be assault but I don't see people assaulting anything with them. -Tarantulas - too costly -Light veh anti-air - it looks like a crippled slasher that can't shoot land targets -Halberds - weak. Does it still cover in armor when not firing? That's useless for a short range unit. -Djinn, Rapier, Krow, Surfboard, Jugglenaut
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thats why goli, jack, and moderator ended up on the not so shit list they are good units, but there are better ways to do it moderator would really benefit from an ark shot, most of the time you are fighting in hills and a straight shot is not effective jack isnt really worth it at 650m cost and goli is a borderline case, ill remove it and the flail
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kapsi the shit list is for units that no one uses at all (or at leas i havent seen more then once in the last 10 games) i dont plan to include striders here unless i find they are really really usless
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quote:
-Tarantulas - too costly
-Light veh anti-air - it looks like a crippled slasher that can't shoot land targets
-Halberds - weak. Does it still cover in armor when not firing? That's useless for a short range unit.
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And this is why your elo is below average.
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Someone needs to walk past kapsi's defenses with a Halberd. You should mess with Djinn before deciding anything. Remember there is a mobile cloaker.
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i have but its still lots of effort to use it, its expensive, and unless i have a bantha/det, i dont have much use for it also i found that its most efffective when built using athena (rather then walking there on ints own) and it needs to be able to teleport lots of units simultaneously (id rather be able to port in 20 raiders then 1 bantha, any time any day) (probably its main problem is that you need to use asult rather then raiders with it)
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Djin is not useless Make anthena make cloaker make djin start having fun right at enemy base BTW, you almost stole my thread idea... but I will create it anyway!
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Since djinn nanoframe ans constructing athena are both visible evev under cloak, i'd suggest a cheaper jammer in form of well, athena itself. And then just teleport the sneaky.
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its still too much work for verry little return id it could be used to warp in a nasty surprise (in the form of 20 glaive) into the middle of the enemy base it would be worth it (but since it takes 2 seconds to teleport each glaive (40 seconds total) there is no element of surprise, and once the djin is found (just follow the screaming/pillaging) the djin is as good as dead and thats -800m and 5 minutes of micro and if you really want to dump a bantha on someones head 1 vindicator usualy gets the job done
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I think Jack is absolutely fine as it is. Combined with the moderator they are awesome. Moderator beam is also fine. I like it that it can't miss. An arced weapon would mean you could dodge it. Which means the warriors will beat the entire jump factory again. Being too micro intensive? Never experienced moderators to be that way. Kinda have to agree on Rapier. I'll pick banshees over rapiers any time. But this might actually be a problem with the Banshee being too good at AA (anti gunship or combined with gnats) than Rapier being bad. Djin just needs more use and testing first imo, just like GoogleFrog said. Hammer still has its uses (as discussed in another thread). They may be slightly overpriced though noting major...
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ill conceede on jacks being somewhat usefull if they have emp/slow support, but i still dont like them much, they are clumbersome, and a poor replasment for a glorified raider (also ive seen people use them a few times in the last several games(they were all killed before making cost btw)) but you are asuming that most people use jumps on flat terain, whereas most people use jumps on hilly terain/areas with numerous sharp changes to height map that will block directfire weapons (making moderator quite ineffective, without ability to jump) ill reconsider djin when people start using them for something, at the moment noone uses them at all (ill play around with them and try and find an intresting application for them that is actualy usefull in mid game)
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quote:
ill conceede on jacks being somewhat usefull if they have emp/slow support, but i still dont like them much, they are clumbersome, and a poor replasment for a glorified raider |
quote:
jacks ... glorified raider |
what? how is melee assault relevant to raiding? :0
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the role of an assult is to be able to charge into heavy porc and kill it... try charging a jack into heavy porc, it will die before it gets in range the point of raiders is to kill weakened/EMPed/lone units jack is verry good at this its class is something like superheavy/raider same with reapers, halberds, and a few otheres that borderline this class
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Oh god you've been shooting crap again, man. Stop doing that, drugs are bad for you :((( A jack can singlehandedly rape almost any lower-tier defense, specifically stinger. Two jacks rape two stingers, and both survive the fight.
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t stingers target a single jack, 1st jack dies, second jack 50% hp by the time stinger 1 dead, stinger 2 then kills second jack
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ok i tried the djin, took 10 minutes to get it into position, once it activated it decloaked, was then spoted by enemy air player and killed 1 minute later by gunshit, all units sent over bridge died in the prosess of defendig the bridge may have worked if i build 2 bridges and my whole team pumped units through them, but from a single player its not effective the bridge itself decloaking once active is a serious problem, makes it imposible to do a proper sneak attak
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Use a jammer nearby and stay out of direct enemy LOS.
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